Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Mid-Tier Matchups # 74: End-of-LOCH GJ vs. End-of-SPW LWC

  1. #1
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    24,248

    Default Mid-Tier Matchups # 74: End-of-LOCH GJ vs. End-of-SPW LWC

    The latest Mid-Tier Matchup finds two main protagonists who, oddly enough, had not yet attained Greats/Elites status by the end of their respective stories. Gwok Jing (LOCH) vs. Ling Wu Chung (SPW).

    Based on their martial arts abilities at the end of their respective novels, who would win?

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    The latest Mid-Tier Matchup finds two main protagonists who, oddly enough, had not yet attained Greats/Elites status by the end of their respective stories. Gwok Jing (LOCH) vs. Ling Wu Chung (SPW).

    Based on their martial arts abilities at the end of their respective novels, who would win?
    GJ win unless LHC fully mastered his DG9S especially palm/qi breaking stance..

  3. #3
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2022
    Posts
    12

    Default

    I can’t seem to remember, did Linghu Chong ever learn YJJ or was that a tv adaption thing?

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Alallen684 View Post
    I can’t seem to remember, did Linghu Chong ever learn YJJ or was that a tv adaption thing?
    He did he learn Yijin Jing for at least 2 years..

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    139

    Default

    We don't have any clear information about LHC's MA situation at the end of SPW.I think JY did this because he knew 9SOD is a ultra overpower art so 9SOD + TAS + AEA is a 2x ultra overpower combination
    His last real tough fight was DFBB before he discover that how he can exploit the weakness of sunflower manual.This is really important because if LHC can exploit his opponent's MA weakness then no matter how many times they fight he always win , for example CX
    He always underestimated himself
    We have two sentences from FZ before he start to learn TAS and 40 month before the end of story.
    Last information about LHC is in the deer and cauldron
    But for this match I pick LHC after his fight against YBQ.It is a better choice.

    LHC after his fight against YBQ vs end loch GJ
    It's a tough fight for both of them.If GJ use all of his power and fight to death to end this fight below 50 exchange , he has a good chance for winning but for each 10 exchange he add to that 50 exchange his chance decrease a lot and by 120-150 exchange he don't have a chance any more and LHC definitely win.



    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    He did he learn Yijin Jing for at least 2 years..
    At the end of SPW ,
    More than 40 months.A few days before YY travel to HS + 3 years gap between her travel and their wedding + 4 months after their wedding==> end of story

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reydge View Post
    We don't have any clear information about LHC's MA situation at the end of SPW.I think JY did this because he knew 9SOD is a ultra overpower art so 9SOD + TAS + AEA is a 2x ultra overpower combination
    His last real tough fight was DFBB before he discover that how he can exploit the weakness of sunflower manual.This is really important because if LHC can exploit his opponent's MA weakness then no matter how many times they fight he always win , for example CX
    He always underestimated himself
    We have two sentences from FZ before he start to learn TAS and 40 month before the end of story.
    Last information about LHC is in the deer and cauldron
    But for this match I pick LHC after his fight against YBQ.It is a better choice.

    LHC after his fight against YBQ vs end loch GJ
    It's a tough fight for both of them.If GJ use all of his power and fight to death to end this fight below 50 exchange , he has a good chance for winning but for each 10 exchange he add to that 50 exchange his chance decrease a lot and by 120-150 exchange he don't have a chance any more and LHC definitely win.

    But as long we never seen how qi/palm breaking stance work i don't think LHC could win again palm user spesialist like GJ especially if he combo with L/R Hand Skill which even people like H7G could not penetrasi his defense..


    At the end of SPW ,
    More than 40 months.A few days before YY travel to HS + 3 years gap between her travel and their wedding + 4 months after their wedding==> end of story
    Yeah you're right

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reydge View Post
    We don't have any clear information about LHC's MA situation at the end of SPW.I think JY did this because he knew 9SOD is a ultra overpower art so 9SOD + TAS + AEA is a 2x ultra overpower combination
    His last real tough fight was DFBB before he discover that how he can exploit the weakness of sunflower manual.This is really important because if LHC can exploit his opponent's MA weakness then no matter how many times they fight he always win , for example CX
    He always underestimated himself
    We have two sentences from FZ before he start to learn TAS and 40 month before the end of story.
    Last information about LHC is in the deer and cauldron
    But for this match I pick LHC after his fight against YBQ.It is a better choice.

    LHC after his fight against YBQ vs end loch GJ
    It's a tough fight for both of them.If GJ use all of his power and fight to death to end this fight below 50 exchange , he has a good chance for winning but for each 10 exchange he add to that 50 exchange his chance decrease a lot and by 120-150 exchange he don't have a chance any more and LHC definitely win.




    At the end of SPW ,
    More than 40 months.A few days before YY travel to HS + 3 years gap between her travel and their wedding + 4 months after their wedding==> end of story
    Sori typo but as long we never seen how qi/palm breaking stance work i don't think LHC could win again palm user spesialist like GJ especially if he combo with L/R Hand Skill which even people like H7G could not penetrasi his defense..

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    139

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    Sori typo but as long we never seen how qi/palm breaking stance work i don't think LHC could win again palm user spesialist like GJ especially if he combo with L/R Hand Skill which even people like H7G could not penetrasi his defense..
    Actually we saw LHC's PBS but yes we didn't see his QBS.
    As I said before 9SOD is a ultra overpower art and If a user could learn it completely then he can easily defeat someone like XZ or SPT and maybe even SM.This is devastating
    When JY merged 9SOD with ASA and TAS the result was even more devastating.I think because of this problem after some chapters in the middle of the story JY didn't focus on LHC progress and after fight against DFBB, JY rarely rarely put him in real fight.
    Even at the end of the story JY didn't give us any good information about LHC's MA situation it is very interesting that we saw Duan yu's MA situation at the end of DGSD and we got some information but we didn't get anything about LHC
    Last edited by reydge; 08-12-22 at 02:37 AM.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reydge View Post
    Actually we saw LHC's PBS but yes we didn't see his QBS.
    As I said before 9SOD is a ultra overpower art and If a user could learn it completely then he can easily defeat someone like XZ or SPT and maybe even SM.This is devastating
    When JY merged 9SOD with ASA and TAS the result was even more devastating.I think because of this problem after some chapters in the middle of the story JY didn't focus on LHC progress and after fight against DFBB, JY rarely rarely put him in real fight.
    Even at the end of the story JY didn't give us any good information about LHC's MA situation it is very interesting that we saw Duan yu's MA situation at the end of DGSD and we got some information but we didn't get anything about LHC
    If Linghu Chong really mastered or ever executed palm-breaking stance why he have no idea at all regarding Ren Woxing and Fangzheng palm skills also i doubt qi-breaking stance could deal with long-distance attack like Yiyang Zhi or LMSJ..

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reydge View Post
    Actually we saw LHC's PBS but yes we didn't see his QBS.
    As I said before 9SOD is a ultra overpower art and If a user could learn it completely then he can easily defeat someone like XZ or SPT and maybe even SM.This is devastating
    When JY merged 9SOD with ASA and TAS the result was even more devastating.I think because of this problem after some chapters in the middle of the story JY didn't focus on LHC progress and after fight against DFBB, JY rarely rarely put him in real fight.
    Even at the end of the story JY didn't give us any good information about LHC's MA situation it is very interesting that we saw Duan yu's MA situation at the end of DGSD and we got some information but we didn't get anything about LHC
    Sori i mean i would not considered DG9S "overkill" since we never know how good palm/qi-breaking stance would "work" against complicated with a lot of bizarre palm style/movement like Sad Palm or Zhou Botong L/R Hand Skill or long-distance type attack like Yiyang Zhi..

  11. #11
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    24,248

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    Sori i mean i would not considered DG9S "overkill" since we never know how good palm/qi-breaking stance would "work" against complicated with a lot of bizarre palm style/movement like Sad Palm or Zhou Botong L/R Hand Skill or long-distance type attack like Yiyang Zhi..
    I think for Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance to work, the user must have at least near equal inner power as the opponent. If the opponent's inner power is exponentially higher (say, at the level of Hui Juk), then Ling Wu Chung would not be successful in using Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance against him. I think the user's power needs to be at least 70% that of the opponents for Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance to be effective.

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    625

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    I think for Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance to work, the user must have at least near equal inner power as the opponent. If the opponent's inner power is exponentially higher (say, at the level of Hui Juk), then Ling Wu Chung would not be successful in using Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance against him. I think the user's power needs to be at least 70% that of the opponents for Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance to be effective.
    We've seen how the palm-breaking stance works at least twice - against Yue Hou (Song Shan) and Yi Guozi (Shaolin). Basically, LHC positions his sword just before his opponent strikes, such that when his opponent attacks, they can't help but skewer one or both their palms like a kebab on the end of LHC's sword. This relies on predicting the coming attack and precision of timing/positioning, not brute power. If LHC can't predict the attack (due to his limited understanding of unarmed combat), then he cannot execute it properly.

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Kwok View Post
    We've seen how the palm-breaking stance works at least twice - against Yue Hou (Song Shan) and Yi Guozi (Shaolin). Basically, LHC positions his sword just before his opponent strikes, such that when his opponent attacks, they can't help but skewer one or both their palms like a kebab on the end of LHC's sword. This relies on predicting the coming attack and precision of timing/positioning, not brute power. If LHC can't predict the attack (due to his limited understanding of unarmed combat), then he cannot execute it properly.
    Well it's mean he still lack of experience regarding palm technique which he himself admit he would train at least for 20 years to compete with masters like Ren Woxing and Fangzheng and since LOCH Guo Jing level more or less equal with him i think Linghu Chong would have "hard time" against Guo Jing 18 Dragon Palm which infused with L/R Hand Skill and 9 Yin unless like i said before he truly mastered palm/qi-breaking stance..

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    I think for Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance to work, the user must have at least near equal inner power as the opponent. If the opponent's inner power is exponentially higher (say, at the level of Hui Juk), then Ling Wu Chung would not be successful in using Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance against him. I think the user's power needs to be at least 70% that of the opponents for Palm/Inner Power-Breaking Stance to be effective.
    To be honest even if you have equal power as your opponent but you don't know how to "deal" with your opponent "technique" especially against long-distance type attack you might be would lose just imagine Wuji which not familiar with Yideng's Yiyang Zhi so i think Linghu Chong which also not familiar with palm/finger/fist/claw (barehanded technique) would be in trouble like Wuji..

  15. #15
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    24,248

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Kwok View Post
    We've seen how the palm-breaking stance works at least twice - against Yue Hou (Song Shan) and Yi Guozi (Shaolin). Basically, LHC positions his sword just before his opponent strikes, such that when his opponent attacks, they can't help but skewer one or both their palms like a kebab on the end of LHC's sword. This relies on predicting the coming attack and precision of timing/positioning, not brute power. If LHC can't predict the attack (due to his limited understanding of unarmed combat), then he cannot execute it properly.
    What if the attack comes in the form of a powerful LDA palm energy/wind attack?

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    What if the attack comes in the form of a powerful LDA palm energy/wind attack?
    I think it is the biggest of DG9S "handicap" since you must close to your opponent to make your "strike" but as long your opponent "keep away" you would not harm him but he would injure you instead especially if he/she is long-distance type attack fighters..

  17. #17
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    139

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    If Linghu Chong really mastered or ever executed palm-breaking stance why he have no idea at all regarding Ren Woxing and Fangzheng palm skills also i doubt qi-breaking stance could deal with long-distance attack like Yiyang Zhi or LMSJ..
    I think the best answer is this

    [“Excellent palm skills!” Linghu Chong acclaimed and swung his long sword upward. Because he couldn’t find a single flaw in Yue Hou’s palm form and his movement, this thrust of his had both defense and offense, ninety percent of it was false while only ten percent of it was real.
    But in Yue Hou’s eyes, this upward swing was brilliant. Regardless of which part of Linghu Chong’s body he planned to strike using his two palms, he would always end up sending the center of his palm toward the tip of the sword. So only half way through the palm strikes with his two hands, he immediately retracted his palms and leapt backward.
    “Excellent sword art!” he shouted.]
    and
    [Succeeded with his remote palm strikes, You Hou figured that his opponent would at least drop down with severe injuries if not drop dead. He had not expected to see Linghu Chong getting off without a scratch. Then immediately after, many reflections from the sword tip flashed, all aiming at the center of his palms. Astounded, he crisscrossed his palms and struck out, one striking toward Linghu Chong’s face, the other one striking toward Linghu Chong’s lower abdomen. Just when he was about to release the energy forces for the strikes, he suddenly felt a violent pain: his one palm on the back of the other, both had been stringed together by the blade of Linghu Chong’s long sword. It was unclear whether Linghu Chong had penetrated his two palms consecutively or he had struck his palms to the tip of the sword himself. All he could see was that his left palm was in front, his right palm was behind, and the exposing blade behind the back of his right palm was as long as five inches......The move he had just used was one of the techniques in the Palm-breaking Stance of the Dugu Nine Swords. Ever since Feng Qingyang went into seclusion, this move had never emerged in the entire Martial World]
    =======
    For long distance attack Qi breaking stance + Arrow breaking stance is a very good option.Didn't LHC use Arrow braking stance to hit 15 fighters ?

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reydge View Post
    I think the best answer is this

    [“Excellent palm skills!” Linghu Chong acclaimed and swung his long sword upward. Because he couldn’t find a single flaw in Yue Hou’s palm form and his movement, this thrust of his had both defense and offense, ninety percent of it was false while only ten percent of it was real.
    But in Yue Hou’s eyes, this upward swing was brilliant. Regardless of which part of Linghu Chong’s body he planned to strike using his two palms, he would always end up sending the center of his palm toward the tip of the sword. So only half way through the palm strikes with his two hands, he immediately retracted his palms and leapt backward.
    “Excellent sword art!” he shouted.]
    and
    [Succeeded with his remote palm strikes, You Hou figured that his opponent would at least drop down with severe injuries if not drop dead. He had not expected to see Linghu Chong getting off without a scratch. Then immediately after, many reflections from the sword tip flashed, all aiming at the center of his palms. Astounded, he crisscrossed his palms and struck out, one striking toward Linghu Chong’s face, the other one striking toward Linghu Chong’s lower abdomen. Just when he was about to release the energy forces for the strikes, he suddenly felt a violent pain: his one palm on the back of the other, both had been stringed together by the blade of Linghu Chong’s long sword. It was unclear whether Linghu Chong had penetrated his two palms consecutively or he had struck his palms to the tip of the sword himself. All he could see was that his left palm was in front, his right palm was behind, and the exposing blade behind the back of his right palm was as long as five inches......The move he had just used was one of the techniques in the Palm-breaking Stance of the Dugu Nine Swords. Ever since Feng Qingyang went into seclusion, this move had never emerged in the entire Martial World]
    =======
    For long distance attack Qi breaking stance + Arrow breaking stance is a very good option.Didn't LHC use Arrow braking stance to hit 15 fighters ?
    C'mon you mean Yiyang Zhi or Sad Palm just like "ordinary attacks" like arrow or palm from 4th grade fighter like Songshan guys..

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reydge View Post
    I think the best answer is this

    [“Excellent palm skills!” Linghu Chong acclaimed and swung his long sword upward. Because he couldn’t find a single flaw in Yue Hou’s palm form and his movement, this thrust of his had both defense and offense, ninety percent of it was false while only ten percent of it was real.
    But in Yue Hou’s eyes, this upward swing was brilliant. Regardless of which part of Linghu Chong’s body he planned to strike using his two palms, he would always end up sending the center of his palm toward the tip of the sword. So only half way through the palm strikes with his two hands, he immediately retracted his palms and leapt backward.
    “Excellent sword art!” he shouted.]
    and
    [Succeeded with his remote palm strikes, You Hou figured that his opponent would at least drop down with severe injuries if not drop dead. He had not expected to see Linghu Chong getting off without a scratch. Then immediately after, many reflections from the sword tip flashed, all aiming at the center of his palms. Astounded, he crisscrossed his palms and struck out, one striking toward Linghu Chong’s face, the other one striking toward Linghu Chong’s lower abdomen. Just when he was about to release the energy forces for the strikes, he suddenly felt a violent pain: his one palm on the back of the other, both had been stringed together by the blade of Linghu Chong’s long sword. It was unclear whether Linghu Chong had penetrated his two palms consecutively or he had struck his palms to the tip of the sword himself. All he could see was that his left palm was in front, his right palm was behind, and the exposing blade behind the back of his right palm was as long as five inches......The move he had just used was one of the techniques in the Palm-breaking Stance of the Dugu Nine Swords. Ever since Feng Qingyang went into seclusion, this move had never emerged in the entire Martial World]
    =======
    For long distance attack Qi breaking stance + Arrow breaking stance is a very good option.Didn't LHC use Arrow braking stance to hit 15 fighters ?
    Then how about it..

    Linghu Chong peered from his vantage point to observe the fight. Great Master Fangzheng's palm moves were unpredictable. Every strike he shot out, it always changed into many different directions when it reached halfway. The palm moves were like illusions and couldn't be observed. On the other hand, Ren Woxing's palm moves were simple. When he struck out or pulled his palm back, it looked quite stiff. But no matter where Fangzheng's palm struck out, Ren Woxing would immediately follow every change and sent his palm there. Linghu Chong saw that these two people were well-matched as they fought with all their powers. His bare-fist martial art was very shallow so he was still not proficient on Dugu Nine Swords' "palm breaking stance". Thus, he was not able to see the flaws in their fist martial art and was unable to see where he could attack.

    These two masters were executing the world highest and most profound palm moves. Linghu Chong was bewildered and did not understand the refined essences of the moves. "In sword art, I was victorious against Priest Chongxu and I wouldn't lose to Mr. Ren if we fight. But against these two people's palm martial art, I have to constantly attack them with a sharp sword. Grand Master uncle Feng said, I have to practise for twenty years before I can fight the world's elite masters. When he said that he was probably mainly referring to the "palm breaking stance"."

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 13
    Last Post: 06-01-22, 04:19 AM
  2. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 05-31-22, 10:45 PM
  3. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 05-08-22, 06:13 AM
  4. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-22-22, 01:51 AM
  5. Replies: 27
    Last Post: 10-23-21, 12:31 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •