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Thread: Fan deductions

  1. #1
    Senior Member Athena's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Fan deductions

    After so many years of discussing Wuxia/Jin Yong, we all have our foibles and theories we are adamant are true. In this thread, I’d like to read what in your opinion your questionable theories are. We are not to discuss each other’s theories, but read them out of curiosity.
    I’ll start:
    DGSD: The Xiaoyao elders are above Xiao Yuanshan, Xiao Feng, Murong Bo and Jiumozhi, but slightly below the sweeper monk.
    Su Xinghe is just marginally weaker than Ding Chunqiu.
    A Zi in the end went insane when she Xiao Feng die. It was a temporary hysteria, but she went mad. I dislike A Zi, but in that scene I really pity her.
    LOCH
    Ma Yu, Qiu Chu Ji, Wang Chuyi are are Mei Chaofeng’s level.
    The Seven Masters and Huang Yaoshi battle at Ox village would have been a MARGINAL win for the Seven Masters.
    How come martial arts experts from Lu Chengfeng, Seven Masters of Quanzhen to Ouyang Feng not see that Qiu Qianzhang was a shyster.
    ROCH:
    I believe the assessment of the five Masters of Quanzhen that Wang Chongyang could defeat the Golden Wheel Monk, Nimoxing, Xiaoxiang Zi and Yin Kexi combined.
    I place Sun Bu’er’s martial arts near Huo Duo as Hao Datong is stated to be around Da’erba, The discrepancy between Sun and Hao can’t be that big. Furhtermorre, Sha Gu was able to hold her ground against Li Mochou, and she only knows a few tricks. Sun Bu’er was taught by Wang Chongyang, Li Mochou can’t be substantially better than her as stated by Jin Yong.
    Guo Jing and Yang Guo are around the same level in martial arts post 16 years.

    HSDS:
    Fan Yao poisoned Yin Qianye, husband of Jinhua Popo.
    The Ming Cult has some exceptional martial artists, but the realm is big and there are more than enough to be equal or superior to them.
    The Lady in yellow isn’t near Zhang Wuji or Zhang Sanfeng’s level.
    Zhou Zhiruo did Xie Xun a favour by killing Du Baidang and YI Sanniang. Xie Xun killed their son and their hatred cannot be appeased by Xie Xun’s repent.

    Smiling Proud Wanderer
    Sword faction’s Cheng Buyou is not weaker than Yue Buqurn. Feng Buping is stronger than Yue Buquen.
    Taishan School’s leader reverend Tianmen is a fool.
    To be continued……
    So huge, so hopeless, to conceive
    As these that twice befell
    Parting is all we know of heaven
    And all we need of hell.

    Emily Dickinson (1830-1886)

  2. #2
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athena View Post
    After so many years of discussing Wuxia/Jin Yong, we all have our foibles and theories we are adamant are true. In this thread, I’d like to read what in your opinion your questionable theories are. We are not to discuss each other’s theories, but read them out of curiosity.
    I’ll start:

    DGSD: The Xiaoyao elders are above Xiao Yuanshan, Xiao Feng, Murong Bo and Jiumozhi, but slightly below the sweeper monk.
    I think that individually, the Siu Yiu Sect Elders are still considerably below the Janitor Monk's level. Collectively (as in all three together), they might be close to matching him.

    Su Xinghe is just marginally weaker than Ding Chunqiu.
    I've never thought otherwise.

    LOCH

    Ma Yu, Qiu Chu Ji, Wang Chuyi are are Mei Chaofeng’s level.
    Pretty close.

    How come martial arts experts from Lu Chengfeng, Seven Masters of Quanzhen to Ouyang Feng not see that Qiu Qianzhang was a shyster.
    I think his fraud was pretty effective. It just didn't work against us, the audience, because we were kind of tipped off that he was a fraud.
    ROCH:

    I believe the assessment of the five Masters of Quanzhen that Wang Chongyang could defeat the Golden Wheel Monk, Nimoxing, Xiaoxiang Zi and Yin Kexi combined.
    Maybe. Gwok Jing looked like he was going to pull it off too until Yeung Gor distracted him.


    Guo Jing and Yang Guo are around the same level in martial arts post 16 years.
    So close that we will never definitively know who was superior.

    HSDS:
    Fan Yao poisoned Yin Qianye, husband of Jinhua Popo.
    I never even thought about this. Fan Yiu seemed too honorable and decent a guy to do something like that. It would seem out of character to me.

    The Ming Cult has some exceptional martial artists, but the realm is big and there are more than enough to be equal or superior to them.
    Their real strength was the large army they amassed.

    The Lady in yellow isn’t near Zhang Wuji or Zhang Sanfeng’s level.
    She could be, but it was never proven that she was.

    Zhou Zhiruo did Xie Xun a favour by killing Du Baidang and YI Sanniang. Xie Xun killed their son and their hatred cannot be appeased by Xie Xun’s repent.
    Never really thought about it, but of course, her intentions were far from benign.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Athena's Avatar
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    Sun Bu’er is not far inferior to Huang Rong and Li Mochou. There is a substantial gap, but far inferior no. I rate her around Huo Du’s level, as Hao Daotong is ranked around Da’reba and Huo Du. The discrepancy between Hao Datong and Sun Bu’er cannot that big. Furthermore, if Qu Shagu could give Li Mochou some difficulty with three stances of a hayfork, Sun Bu’er with a plethora of Quanzhen skills should at least be able to hold her ground for some time before she loses to Li Mochou.

    Mei Renfeng is not undisputed top one martial artist in the Young Flying Fox and The Flying Fox of Snowy Mountain. I count that there are 20 martial artists who are roughly his level. All 20 have other things to such as trying to overthrow the Qing Dynasty.
    Jiunan may be the top one martial artist in the Duke of Mount Deer, but she is not a good fighter. She does well one on one, but has difficulty with a group ganging up on her in a confined tavern inn.
    So huge, so hopeless, to conceive
    As these that twice befell
    Parting is all we know of heaven
    And all we need of hell.

    Emily Dickinson (1830-1886)

  4. #4
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athena View Post
    Sun Bu’er is not far inferior to Huang Rong and Li Mochou. There is a substantial gap, but far inferior no. I rate her around Huo Du’s level, as Hao Daotong is ranked around Da’reba and Huo Du. The discrepancy between Hao Datong and Sun Bu’er cannot that big. Furthermore, if Qu Shagu could give Li Mochou some difficulty with three stances of a hayfork, Sun Bu’er with a plethora of Quanzhen skills should at least be able to hold her ground for some time before she loses to Li Mochou.
    LOCH '82 and ROCH '83 (TVB) gave Sheun But Yee really bad showings. She seemed to lose (badly) to everybody...Au Yeung Hak in LOCH and Golden Wheel Monk, Yeung Gor, and Gung Sheun Tze (on separate occasions) in ROCH. The only fight she won in either series was against the young Luk Gwoon Ying in LOCH '82.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Athena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    LOCH '82 and ROCH '83 (TVB) gave Sheun But Yee really bad showings. She seemed to lose (badly) to everybody...Au Yeung Hak in LOCH and Golden Wheel Monk, Yeung Gor, and Gung Sheun Tze (on separate occasions) in ROCH. The only fight she won in either series was against the young Luk Gwoon Ying in LOCH '82.
    TVB was inconsistent with her, because in ROCH she did pretty welll against Gongsun Zhi at the Chongyang Temple.
    So huge, so hopeless, to conceive
    As these that twice befell
    Parting is all we know of heaven
    And all we need of hell.

    Emily Dickinson (1830-1886)

  6. #6
    Senior Member CancerLuna's Avatar
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    > The Lady in yellow isn’t near Zhang Wuji or Zhang Sanfeng’s level.

    I feel like martial arts wise, narratively, she seemed to be the hidden dragon to ZWJ's crouching tiger. It's impossible to gauge her level anyways but I'd put her there myself.

    my 1 main deduction;
    dfbb is kind of a fraud (aka overrated) and shouldn't be rated over XF/GJ/YG

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    Quote Originally Posted by CancerLuna View Post
    > The Lady in yellow isn’t near Zhang Wuji or Zhang Sanfeng’s level.

    I feel like martial arts wise, narratively, she seemed to be the hidden dragon to ZWJ's crouching tiger. It's impossible to gauge her level anyways but I'd put her there myself.

    my 1 main deduction;
    dfbb is kind of a fraud (aka overrated) and shouldn't be rated over XF/GJ/YG
    Well after re-read SPW I do believe that DFBB at least around ROCH Greats level not below them which mean he/she would be "equal" with any of XF/GJ if not slightly better..

  8. #8
    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athena View Post
    DGSD: The Xiaoyao elders are above Xiao Yuanshan, Xiao Feng, Murong Bo and Jiumozhi, but slightly below the sweeper monk.
    Su Xinghe is just marginally weaker than Ding Chunqiu.
    A Zi in the end went insane when she Xiao Feng die. It was a temporary hysteria, but she went mad. I dislike A Zi, but in that scene I really pity her.
    Dont get me started on this. I would like to think of the 3 being really demi-god like but it just doesnt make sense once their powers flow into XZ and when TSTL is shocked by MYF's shifting skill.

    If Su Xinghe was just marginally weaker, he would have been able to totally wipe DCQ if WYZ just gave him that 70 years of power.

    Thats how i read it. She just went hysterical/mad from grief.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

  9. #9
    Senior Member Athena's Avatar
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    Hu Fei only found out that he did love Cheng Lingsu after she died. That scene always makes me teary.

    Guo Xiang was destined to stay single. The two most important men in her life were her father Guo Jing and Yang Guo. The men she met, who are quite extradorinary, He Zudao and Zhang Junbao are good men, but they pale in comparison to Guo Jing and Yang Guo. I really love Guo Xiang as a character and find out that she turned into Buddhist nun makes me teary as well
    So huge, so hopeless, to conceive
    As these that twice befell
    Parting is all we know of heaven
    And all we need of hell.

    Emily Dickinson (1830-1886)

  10. #10
    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athena View Post

    Guo Xiang was destined to stay single. The two most important men in her life were her father Guo Jing and Yang Guo. The men she met, who are quite extradorinary, He Zudao and Zhang Junbao are good men, but they pale in comparison to Guo Jing and Yang Guo. I really love Guo Xiang as a character and find out that she turned into Buddhist nun makes me teary as well
    Hmm, I would think its debatable if ZZB 'pales in comparison' to Yang Guo.

    Unless you argue that by the time he matched YG's achievements, he was already way too advanced in age and GX was already a nun.

    In any case, the Z3F story just doesnt allow the romance to work out.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

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