HSDS storyline questions(WARNING : Possible Spoilers)

[Question2]

I've only read chapters 1-7 of 1st edition HSDS,and the chapters covering guanming peak,as well as chapters 5-11 of 2nd edition HSDS,and much of my HSDS knowledge comes from the TV series that ended,about 18 minutes ago as of this writing,in singapore,so please forgive me if i post something "wrong".

1.Can anyone tell me more about the Xuanming Elders?Are they a real sect,or just 2 mercenaries who happened to be Zhao Min's Father's bodyguards?In what context would they happen to have injured Zhan Wu Ji,when he was just a child?I cant see any situation in which someone like that would hit a small child with such a move.

2.Does the book explain who "Sister Yang" is?Its heavily hinted in the TV series that shes a descendant from Guo Jiang or one of the famous people in Condor Heroes,which would explain how she knows Jiuyin White Bone Claw.

3.Which sects attended the "Slay the Lion meet"?I know the Ming,Beggar,E-Mei,Kong Tong and Wudang Sects attended?Did i miss anyone else?Who was the first guy who challenged Song Qingshu?Was he from the Beggar Sect?

4.What happened to the 18 dragon subdueing palms manuel at the end of the story?Was it given to Shaolin?For that matter,how were the 18 dragon subdueing palms and Jiuyin white bone claw manuels lost from their respective sects?

5.How did Zhang Wu Ji find the Jiuyang Shengong manuel?What kind of martial art is it?From the hints i see,i get that its supposed to be some martial art that trains your internal strength and not like a traditional "skill"?

6.Curious...anyone know where the bat king is near the end of the TV series?Hes supposed to go with Zhang Wu Ji to Shaolin,but hes nowhere to be seen,and its not mentioned that he stayed with Zhu YuangZhang/Vanguard Yang.Same thing with Fan Yao....after he gets rescued in the capitol,its like hes not in Ming Sect affairs anymore,theres totally no mention of him.

7.Why did cheng kun try to blind Xie Xun when he knew perfectly well he was already blind?For that matter,when Cheng Kun took Xie Xun captive,why didnt Xie Xun actually HIT Cheng Kun?He just stops himself from hitting him?And then collasped at Cheng Kun's command?And what did Cheng Kun mean by "I spent a lot of time in Shaolin thinking about how to defeat your Qishang Fist"?I couldnt help but think that the producers were trying to tell us Cheng Kun mastered mind control while in Shaolin......

P.S.How come Zhiruou takes forever to actually kill Xie Xun at Shaolin?Simple matter to slash his throat since hes had his acu points block,but she does some funky thing by placing her hand on his head?I dont know what the show producers were thinking with that scence IMHO.

[JigSta]

Hmmm, I'll take a shot at answering some of your questions.

1. The Xuanming Elders injured ZWJ to try and force his parents to reveal the location of XX and the dragon sabre.

2. It is hinted that 'Sister/Lady Yang' is a descendent of YG and XLN (from ROCH). Either that all she is a student of the Ancient Tomb Sect (Once again, YG and XLN's sect)

4. Jiuyin white bone claw is a skill that is part of the 9 Yin manual (the manual everyone wanted in LOCH) It does not belong to any sect. HR placed the 18 Dragon subduing palms manual and the 9 Yin manual into the Dragon Sabre in hopes that a 'hero' could use it to defeat the Mongolians (IIRC. did she also put in the war tactics book?). Also, the 9 Yin manual in the sabre is the 'streamlined' version, edited by HR herself. It is debatable if it still retained it's full 'brilliance' after the 'streamline'. I assume the dragon palms manual would have been returned to the beggars clan (someone can correct me).

Well, that's all I got. lol. other people can answer in much more detail

EDIT: my mistake, confuesed 9 Yin with YJJ

[junzi]

3.Which sects attended the "Slay the Lion meet"?I know the Ming,Beggar,E-Mei,Kong Tong and Wudang Sects attended?Did i miss anyone else?Who was the first guy who challenged Song Qingshu?Was he from the Beggar Sect?


7.Why did cheng kun try to blind Xie Xun when he knew perfectly well he was already blind?

3. I think Kunlun Sect was there too? And some other minor sects I think. According to the novel that is. Yes I think that guy was from Beggar Clan - the guy whom Shi Hongshi was crying out for?

7. Yes I was wondering about that too! Maybe Cheng Kun's intention was to cause as much injury to Xie Xun as possible. So he just attacked anywhere Xie Xun was vulnerable. This part was not true to the novel right?

[Question2]

My chinese standard is nil,so i cant read the novel itself unfornately :P

No,i meant the first guy who challenged Song Qingshu and got beat all the way back to what LOOKED like the area where the Beggar sect was seating,not Elder Wu who got killed.

Yea well it didnt really injure Xie Xun.I cant really understand why Chengkun didnt hurt Xie Xun with his first strike as well.

[wkeej]

besides, i have the following. hope someone can help, based on the ending episode. hehe.
(1) who killed xuanming elders? zhu-er or zzr?
(2) why zzr hug zwj when she saw zm, except to make zm jealous?
(3) when zzr met zwj after immobilizing zm, she said she wanted to clarify a doubt. the doubt pertains to zwj's love and/or whether zhu-er is alive?
(4) zzr mentioned dadu - that's place of zm's house. may i know where is dadu in today's map?
(5) where is island of ice and fire according to today's map?

4.What happened to the 18 dragon subdueing palms manuel at the end of the story?Was it given to Shaolin?For that matter,how were the 18 dragon subdueing palms and Jiuyin white bone claw manuels lost from their respective sects?

[Laviathan]

(4) zzr mentioned dadu - that's place of zm's house. may i know where is dadu in today's map?

Dadu was the name of the Yuan Dynasty capitol, present-day Beijing.

This info can be easily found on Google, btw...

(5) where is island of ice and fire according to today's map?

You do realise the island is fictionate, right? Anyway, it was told in the novel that it was near the Northpole...

7.Why did cheng kun try to blind Xie Xun when he knew perfectly well he was already blind?

Because he was just too caught up in the fierce battle that he simply forgot. At the moment he struck Xie Xun's eyes, Cheng Kun immediately realised he made a mistake... "Oh no! Why was I so stupid to attack his eyes? He's already blind!"

This was told in the novel.

[wkeej]

north pole.
hmm, anyway, if zwj and zm can travel from beijing to north pole, they would not have any difficulty to go persia to resuce xiao zhao. just a thought.
can i assume snake island is taiwan then. hehe.

[Tazzy1972]

no background info on the Xuan Ming elders??

[wkeej]

anyone can advise me on this:
assume that snake island is taiwan, and the persian ming cult travelled to snake island by ship. how long will it need?

[foreva]

Well.. it depends on which part of china you will want to sail to?

[wkeej]

oh it's taiwan. hehe.

Well.. it depends on which part of china you will want to sail to?

[TaiHan]

north pole.
hmm, anyway, if zwj and zm can travel from beijing to north pole, they would not have any difficulty to go persia to resuce xiao zhao. just a thought.
can i assume snake island is taiwan then. hehe.

ZM never went to the North Pole.

[wkeej]

is the island of ice and fire. lavit (above post) mentioned that in the novel, it is some where near the north pole. hehe.

ZM never went to the North Pole.

[Tazzy1972]

near not= at

[Yun_Feiyang]

5.How did Zhang Wu Ji find the Jiuyang Shengong manuel?What kind of martial art is it?From the hints i see,i get that its supposed to be some martial art that trains your internal strength and not like a traditional "skill"?

Managed to catch the last few episodes of HSDS 2002 on a hotel TV in Beijing last week. Wonderful idea to screen 2 or 3 episodes back to back at one time.

The caveat here is that I haven't read the novel but have always have intrigued with the elements of Jiuyang Shengong (JYSG), especially its origin. Who wrote it? Who invented it? And most importantly, who left the manual in the monkey's body and why?

The way I understand it, and I'm taking huge liberties in my interpretation here since I've not read the novel, is that JYSG is primarily a body conditioning exercise aimed at increasing one's internal strength. Of course, once great internal strength is achieved, the ability to defeat opponents may be an incidental benefit but that's not the primary goal.

To further illustrate, for those of you here who do karate (especially traditional Okinawan karate), there is a basic but very important karate kata (forms) called sanchin where deep breathing and exaggerated muscle tension is utilized. This kata doesn't actually directly develop one's fighting skills as such but is more a form of body conditioning exercise aimed at toughening the body, developing physical strength and strengthing one's internal organs. Controversially, its also supposed to increase one's ki (or chi).

As far as my interpretation of Jin Yong's JYSG is concerned, if there are scholars here of Jin Yong novels or better yet, any academics on the subject of Jin Yong himself, please enlighten us.

[rabadi]

Who wrote it? Who invented it?

Jin Yong wrote it j/k
In HSDS 1st edition, Damo invented 9 Yang Manual. In HSDS 2nd edition, however, I think this info was removed. A few speculations arised in this forum in the past, some speculated the repented MRB and XYS from DGSD invented it, other said the repented JMZ invented it, etc. But in the end, it is not clear who the real inventor of 9 Yang Manual was.

And most importantly, who left the manual in the monkey's body and why?

Too lazy to give the answer, I'll just post an article by Ken Cheng here to answer your question:
http://www.geocities.com/jyheroes/9yin9yang.html

[Yun_Feiyang]

Jin Yong wrote it j/k
In HSDS 1st edition, Damo invented 9 Yang Manual. In HSDS 2nd edition, however, I think this info was removed. A few speculations arised in this forum in the past, some speculated the repented MRB and XYS from DGSD invented it, other said the repented JMZ invented it, etc. But in the end, it is not clear who the real inventor of 9 Yang Manual was.

I buy the Damo as inventor theory (assuming that Damo actually exists).

Legend has it that Damo taught some deep breathing exercises to the shaolin monks to help improve their physical health and strength. This sounds like where Jin Yong got his JYSG idea...

[Carefree Assassin]

In the novel there was never a 18 Dragon Subdueing Palms hidden in the Heavenly Sword, just the edited 9 Yin. Song QingShu never made it as far as the kill the lion meeting. Zhanf San Feng shattered his brain to pulp for being a traitor and "scum of the earth."

[TaiHan]

is the island of ice and fire. lavit (above post) mentioned that in the novel, it is some where near the north pole. hehe.

I just said ZM hadn't; I didn't say ZWJ hadn't been there. ZWJ never went back there.

[Question2]

Can anyone tell us if the Xuanming Elders are described in further detial in the book?

Secondly,i thought Z3F was the "benevolent grandmaster" or some sort,why he do that to Song Qingshu?Was Chen Youliang really that instrumental in tricking Qingshu into doing those things?If not,i can see why......

Thirdly,can anyone fathom what the HELL we are supposed to draw from the HSDS 2003 scences which i listed in the original post?E.G.When the producers seem to be telling us that Cheng Kun mastered mind-control while in Shaolin to deal with XX's Qishang Fist,and why Zhiruo takes forever to try and kill a immobilized XX........