The top weapons, sword skill, palm, knife, internal and so on

[jue shi hao jian]

Top weapons anyone? Whats your ranking? And sword skill? Generally 6mss is the top or is it dg9s? which is third? Internal strength? YJJ, 9yin, 9yang? Or any other in other novels/comic? Come give your 2cents worth

[Han Solo]

Top weapon:-
1) GL's Peacock Dart
2) JY's DGKB Heavy Iron Sword
3) Heavenly Sword and Dragon Saber
......


Top sword skills
1) 6MSJ
2) DG9J
3) Taichi sword
4) Jade Maiden sword
............

Internal strength
1) YJJ
2) 8Huang6He WeiwoduzunGong
3) Xiao Wu Xiang Gong
4) Bei Ming Shen Gong
5) 9 yang
6) 9 yin
7) Quan Zhen / Wudang internal energy

[qiaofeng]

6 mai shen jian is not a sword skill even thou its got the word jian. its wu xing jian qi, which is actually qi. theres no physical swords involved, which makes it even deadlier

[bliss]

6 mai shen jian is not a sword skill even thou its got the word jian. its wu xing jian qi, which is actually qi. theres no physical swords involved, which makes it even deadlier

6 Mai Shen Jian IS a sword skill. Although it uses formless sword qi, the moves represent sword moves that would be done if a visible sword were present. So in all essence, its much more a sword style than a qi style.

[qiaofeng]

all sword skills require at least a physical weapon to be present. 6msj doesnt. even thou the sword energy generated can slash n pierce like a sword. its more similar to yi yang zhi than a sword skill

[CC]

all sword skills require at least a physical weapon to be present. 6msj doesnt. even thou the sword energy generated can slash n pierce like a sword. its more similar to yi yang zhi than a sword skill

Its one of those high level wuxia existential theory plot device thingys where the ultimate in sword skills doesn't need a physical sword. Geddid?

Its like when LHC used his fingers to poke the enemy. He _was_ using DG9J at that time, but without a sword.

[qiaofeng]

yang guo's an ran xiao hun zhang was created based off the principles of all the skills he has learnt such as hama gong, tan zi shen tong etc. but it is a palm skill as it was created with the use of the palms in mind. dog beating stick can be used with any weapon, even a club or an oar, but its not as effective as using a stick, cus the skill was created to be used most effectively with a stick. so it is a stick skill. n yes u can use dugu 9 jian with ur finger or even a club, but itll probably work against crappy opponents, againsts any top fighter at ur level n ur gonna get screwed. that being said 6msj is created with the use of qi projected from ur finger in mind, n even thou it does encompasses sword techniques, u cant use it with a sword. eg. if someone comes charging towards u with a sword, u can block it with ur sword qi, ur opponents sword will go right thru. u either shoot ur qi at ur opponent or beak the sword by piercing it with ur qi. geddit ?

[bliss]

The point is, there are coherent sword moves intrinsic to Liu Mai Shenjian. You're arguing that its only a "qi" style, and much more like Yi Yang Zhi? That's a contradiction in itself, but ignoring that ... First of all, if its just a "qi" style, that would put it in the same category of pure "qi" styles like Jiuyang and Yijinjing. I don't think that categorization works on any level, Liu Mai Shenjian has set moves, strokes and techniques. Your second argument is that its like Yi Yang Zhi which is a "finger" technique. Finger techniques basically focus solely on thrusting motions, concentrating all force on the tip, and aiming for critical accupoints. That's what Yiyang Zhi was. Liu Mai Shenjian on the other hand not only incorporated thrusting but also slashing from side to side, much like what you would do with a sword, sabre, or any bladed weapon.

Either way, it makes no sense to say Liumai Shenjian is a"qi" technique (because it has moves) or a "finger" technique (because it has slashes in addition to thrusts). Liumai Shenjian is a sword technique. When it doubt, its best to trust the author's original intent. Its not called Liumai Shengong or Liumai Shenzhi.

[CC]

yang guo's an ran xiao hun zhang was created based off the principles of all the skills he has learnt such as hama gong, tan zi shen tong etc. but it is a palm skill as it was created with the use of the palms in mind. dog beating stick can be used with any weapon, even a club or an oar, but its not as effective as using a stick, cus the skill was created to be used most effectively with a stick. so it is a stick skill. n yes u can use dugu 9 jian with ur finger or even a club, but itll probably work against crappy opponents, againsts any top fighter at ur level n ur gonna get screwed. that being said 6msj is created with the use of qi projected from ur finger in mind, n even thou it does encompasses sword techniques, u cant use it with a sword. eg. if someone comes charging towards u with a sword, u can block it with ur sword qi, ur opponents sword will go right thru. u either shoot ur qi at ur opponent or beak the sword by piercing it with ur qi. geddit ?

Yes, DG9J might be more effective with a sword then a finger. But then again, DG9J might be more effective with the heaven sword rather then a normal sword. And more effective with a normal sword then a rusty blunt sword. When does it end?

[qiaofeng]

The point is, there are coherent sword moves intrinsic to Liu Mai Shenjian. You're arguing that its only a "qi" style, and much more like Yi Yang Zhi? That's a contradiction in itself, but ignoring that ... First of all, if its just a "qi" style, that would put it in the same category of pure "qi" styles like Jiuyang and Yijinjing. I don't think that categorization works on any level, Liu Mai Shenjian has set moves, strokes and techniques. Your second argument is that its like Yi Yang Zhi which is a "finger" technique. Finger techniques basically focus solely on thrusting motions, concentrating all force on the tip, and aiming for critical accupoints. That's what Yiyang Zhi was. Liu Mai Shenjian on the other hand not only incorporated thrusting but also slashing from side to side, much like what you would do with a sword, sabre, or any bladed weapon.

Either way, it makes no sense to say Liumai Shenjian is a"qi" technique (because it has moves) or a "finger" technique (because it has slashes in addition to thrusts). Liumai Shenjian is a sword technique. When it doubt, its best to trust the author's original intent. Its not called Liumai Shengong or Liumai Shenzhi.

read my post carefully i did not say that it is JUST a qi style. i said that the weapon of choice is invisible sword energy aka wu xing jian qi. it was never intended to be used with a physical sword. still it may be possible to shoot it from swords, as duan yanqing demonstrated this by using his yi yang zhi with crutches. and yes, yi yang zi is mainly abt attacking accupoints with qi projected from the fingers. 6msj is an more advanced form, i vaguely remember the part where one of the monks from tianlong temple telling it to duan zhengming, so correct me if im wrong. and the jian in 6 mai shen jian doesnt refer to a physical sword. it refers to wu xing jian qi, doesnt take a genius to figure that out does it ? and with reference to a "qi" technique, ure probably refering to inner energy cultivation, which 6msj is not, so obviously it wont be called 6 mai shengong

[kyss of the sword]

'sword' is a general term, like 'palm' dosen't mean palm only, there can be locking, claws, and accpoint hitting, 'fist' can contain punch and kicks. 'sword' dosen't refer to using an actually sword but the intention of the sword. cutting , slashing, pirceing. whether you use a sword, saber or knife, at the highest level you can use the weapon any way you want, 6msj uses qi, like all advanced sword forms, qi gives force to the 'sword'. with 6msj , in stead of using a saber,sword or knife , you use your finger as a 'sword' , but the intention is the same.

[{quote=qioafeng}read my post carefully i did not say that it is JUST a qi style. i said that the weapon of choice is invisible sword energy aka wu xing jian qi. it was never intended to be used with a physical sword. still it may be possible to shoot it from swords, as duan yanqing demonstrated this by using his yi yang zhi with crutches. and yes, yi yang zi is mainly abt attacking accupoints with qi projected from the fingers. 6msj is an more advanced form, i vaguely remember the part where one of the monks from tianlong temple telling it to duan zhengming, so correct me if im wrong. and the jian in 6 mai shen jian doesnt refer to a physical sword. it refers to wu xing jian qi, doesnt take a genius to figure that out does it ? and with reference to a "qi" technique, ure probably refering to inner energy cultivation, which 6msj is not, so obviously it wont be called 6 mai shengong]

the duans have actually three family skills, yiyang finger,duan swordplay and 6msj.yiyang finger is the first skill leanrt, it's profound and poweful. duan swordplay is not as powerful as yiyang finger but it is the second skilll learnt. duan swordplay is not meant to be powerful on it's own but to carry the power of yiyang finger into weapons, like duan yanqing did with his crutches and zhi zi liu(roch) did with his brush{yiyang sword}(i made the name to describe the stage of the skill). 6msj was the third skill after you mastered the other two. it was the stage of using your finger/hand(qi) as a sword and over coming the sword without a sword(like dugu quibi). it's carrying {yiyang sword} to the next stage {sword qi}.
.

[bliss]

The whole point I was trying to illustrate was that LMSJ classified as a "sword" skill, which is what was stated above that you were objecting to. "Sword Qi" skill still utilizes sword moves and sword techniques, thats where its drawing its theory on. Unless you claim that sword qi skills use different techniques than sword skills (slashing, thrusting), then LMSJ is a SWORD skill. Dugu Qiubai in trying to attain his sword without a sword principle still focused on the sword as his inspiration for its techniques. Its not like all of a sudden without a sword, sword qi means you utilize drastically different moves and strokes than if a sword were there.

[jue shi hao jian]

I would personally believe 6MSJ is a sword skill, at least thats what JY thinks i suppose. Afterall he did write that when qmz requested a copy from TL temple. He said he heard it from MRP that its the top sword skill in the world( tian xia jian fa zi zui.) And if thats what Jin Yong wrote, i guess i could only agree ya? Kinda contradicting to say that theres jian qi, but not a sword skill coz theres no sword aint it? Under that reasoning, if there is no physical sword, where does the sword energy comes from?