Xu Zhu, instead of XF, strikes Sweeper Monk with Dragon Palms

[Ren Wo Xing]

What would happen if it was the Xu Zhu of Chapter 50 who struck Sweeper Monk with the refined Dragon Palms which he and Xiao Feng worked on together? This is assuming full utilization of all his 100-150 years of pure Beiming energy in an all out strike, with much the same scenario as Xiao Feng striking Sweeper; ie, Sweeper does not block, and Xu Zhu hits Sweeper head on with full power.

[PJ]

Xiao Feng was able to do some damage to Sweeper Monk with ONE palm. If we assume Xuzhu also hits Sweeper Monk with ONE palm, I would predict the result to be: Sweeper Monk would be more critically injured.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Gets one shot at the old bastard.

[Han Solo]

Gets one shot at the old bastard.

Da sweeper would be a weeper,
when he got da hit.
as he knows that he's a gonner,
he went into a shit.

[JamesG]

Da sweeper would be a weeper,
when he got da hit.
as he knows that he's a gonner,
he went into a shit.

Don't give up your day job HS. A rapper [or poet] you ain't.....

[Han Solo]

Don't give up your day job HS. A rapper [or poet] you ain't.....

LOL.

I just need to write,
In fact, try as i might,
Nothing seems to go right,
I am nothing but mite,
Concite and cried.

[ProtoM]

One hit from XZ and the Sweeper will definitely find enlightment faster.

[kwekmh]

He might not die due to his abundant internal energy, but not being critically injured after taking a full hit from Xu Zhu with the refined Dragon Palms sounds ridiculous.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Something to consider: Zhang Sanfeng took a full-on suckerpunch that he didn't/couldn't defend against from a Shaolin fireworker monk whose internal energy wasn't nearly as profound as his, and was still gravely injured.

For Xu Zhu not to be able to gravely injure Sweeper with that blow means that Sweeper has much, much more internal energy than Xu Zhu.

[shenlong]

Always under the impression Sweeper let XF hit him, so I don't think XZ would be able to accomplish anything. Of course, if Sweeper let XZ hit him I think Sweeper would die.

[CC]

In theory, a full powered Dragon Palm from end-of-story Xu Zhu should shatter Sweeper Monk's bones if it connected.

However, Jin Yong would not let that happen and spoil his plot device. If he really was forced to let XZ hit Sweeper, he would write something like :

Although the Bei Ming Zhen Qi inside Xu Zhu's body and the Xiang Long Zhang both had their origins in the I-Ching, the nature of Xiao Yao Pai's martial arts were vicious and Yin in nature while the Xiang Long Zhang was of the extreme Yang orthodox school. Thus, even though Xu Zhu had absorbed the essence of the Xiang Long Zhang, the full strength of his Bei Ming Zhen Qi was restrained.

[Wu Wudi]

Was it made clear whether Sweeper intentionally allowed XF to hit him or not? I kinda feel that Sweeper gave XF a free hit to dissipate his anger. If it were intentional, then I'll say that XZ probably can't break Sweeper's chi barrier.

[PJ]

Was it made clear whether Sweeper intentionally allowed XF to hit him or not? I kinda feel that Sweeper gave XF a free hit to dissipate his anger. If it were intentional, then I'll say that XZ probably can't break Sweeper's chi barrier.

I am of the opinion that Sweeper Monk did NOT use any internal energy to block Xiao Feng's attack. My reason is that if he did use internal energy to block, Xiao Feng might be a goner. Consider how Reverend Jueyuan repelled Xiao Xiangzi; how Xuzhu repelled LOTUS FAIRY Cui Luhua; and how Shi Potian repelled IRON PALM Zhan Fei -- these cases show that if a lower tier fighter hits an upper tier fighter, the upper tier fighter's auto-protect function automatically repels and injures the attacker.

HOWEVER, the other question is, was Sweeper Monk in the condition to be able to use internal energy to block the attack? Something to consider is that He was attacking Xiao Yuanshan at the same time, which may have used up most of his power, so even if he wanted to block, he may not have the resource to do so.

[Wu Wudi]

HOWEVER, the other question is, was Sweeper Monk in the condition to be able to use internal energy to block the attack? Something to consider is that He was attacking Xiao Yuanshan at the same time, which may have used up most of his power, so even if he wanted to block, he may not have the resource to do so.

I'm quite sure that SW had enough energy for defense. The way he destroyed everyone in that exchange was the definition of pwnage. SM made beating those guys down look easier than swatting flies.

Also, when I talked about energy barrier, I was talking about the chi wall that SM extended outside his body. I don't think that XF would have gotten past that if SM hadn't allowed it.

[PJ]

I'm quite sure that SW had enough energy for defense.

Not necessarily. Look at the way it was described:

不料那老僧右掌这一招中途变向，纯真虚招，只是要引开萧峰双掌中的一掌之力，以减轻推向自身的力道。

The underlined portions shows that Sweeper Monk was afraid of receiving a full-scale hit by Xiao Feng. He definitely would have been MORE injured if Xiao Feng actually hit him with maximum force, so we can see Sweeper Monk isn't all that shentong guangda.

The way he destroyed everyone in that exchange was the definition of pwnage. SM made beating those guys down look easier than swatting flies.

That's a bit exaggerated. Here is an analysis that I wrote in the past:



From the novel: 慕容博初时见那老僧走近，也不在意，待见他伸掌拍向自己天灵盖，左手忙上抬相格

When Sweeper Monk first approached Murong Bo to "kill" him, Murong Bo was not expecting one bit of danger. Only after the Sweeper Monk launched a killing gesture did Murong Bo prepare defense in a hurry. I think that qualifies as catching him off guard.

I would like to mention that Sweeper Monk did not appear like he was capable of tapping Xiao Yuanshan to death while taking 2 full palm blast from Xiao Feng, and that is why he tricked Xiao Feng into only sending out a single palm:

那老僧说着踏上一步，提起手掌，往萧远山头拍将下去。 萧峰大惊，大声喝道：“住手！”双掌齐出，向那老僧当胸猛击过去。那老僧伸出左掌，将萧峰双掌推来之力一挡，右掌却仍是拍向萧远山头顶。
萧远山全没想到抵御，眼见那老僧的右掌正要碰到他脑门，那老僧突然大喝一声，右掌改向萧峰击去。
萧峰双掌之力正要他左掌相持，突见他右掌转而袭击自己，当即抽出左掌抵挡，同时叫道：“爹爹，快走，快走！ ”不料那老僧右掌这一招中途变向，纯真虚招，只是要引开萧峰双掌中的一掌之力，以减轻推向自身的力道。萧峰左掌一回，那老僧的右掌立即圈转，波的一声轻响，已击中了萧远山的顶门。
便在此时，萧峰的右掌已跟着击到，砰的一声呼，重重打中那老僧胸口，跟着喀喇喇几声，肋骨断了几根。那老僧 微微一笑，道：“好俊的功夫！降龙十八掌，果然天下第一。”这个“一”字一说出，口中一股鲜血跟着直喷了出 来。

In this scene, it was explicitly stated that Xiao Yuanshan did not bear any intention of fighting back. Sweeper Monk at first directed one blow at Xiao Feng and one at Xiao Yuanshan. He then suddenly directed both blows at Xiao Feng in a tricky gesture. Now, I ask members of the forum, what if Xiao Yuanshan was not sincerely waiting to die, and at this time suddenly ambushed the Sweeper Monk while Sweeper Monk was devoting full attention to Xiao Feng? In that case I highly doubt Sweeper Monk would not suffer some terrible fate. He was just lucky that both papas did not really fight back. Murong Bo put on a defensive gesture while Xiao Yuanshan didn't do jack.

[CC]

I am of the opinion that Sweeper Monk did NOT use any internal energy to block Xiao Feng's attack. My reason is that if he did use internal energy to block, Xiao Feng might be a goner. Consider how Reverend Jueyuan repelled Xiao Xiangzi; how Xuzhu repelled LOTUS FAIRY Cui Luhua; and how Shi Potian repelled IRON PALM Zhan Fei -- these cases show that if a lower tier fighter hits an upper tier fighter, the upper tier fighter's auto-protect function automatically repels and injures the attacker.

2 factors argue against that.

1. Mr Zen had previously shown that his protective chi was gentle on the attacker. Murong Fu with probably 20% of XF's inner strength was totally unharmed when he struck at Mr Zen.

2. If Sweeper had about 3 times XF's inner power, XF should still not be injured. Xu Zhu had about 3 times JMZ's inner strength, all those blows that JMZ landed on him did not harm JMZ.

Besides, with no inner energy to protect him, an old man like him should be dead when hit by a full power XF Dragon Palm.

[CC]

Only after the Sweeper Monk launched a killing gesture did Murong Bo prepare defense in a hurry. I think that qualifies as catching him off guard.

Regardless, the defensive stance which he prepared was still considered to be 'Perfect' by both Papa and Junior Xiao. It meant that with the time Sweeper allowed him, it was sufficient for him to prepare.

Since his level was close to the 2 Xiaos, whatever stance the 2 Xiaos considered 'Perfect/Impenetrable' should be about as good as MRB could have taken given enough time.

[PJ]

Regardless, the defensive stance which he prepared was still considered to be 'Perfect' by both Papa and Junior Xiao. It meant that with the time Sweeper allowed him, it was sufficient for him to prepare.

Defensive is the key here. If he went offensive, the result might be different.

Just look at how Linghu Chong's "let's die together" offensive attacks saved his life against Dongfang Bubai. Had he defended instead, he might have been a goner.

[PJ]

2 factors argue against that.

1. Mr Zen had previously shown that his protective chi was gentle on the attacker. Murong Fu with probably 20% of XF's inner strength was totally unharmed when he struck at Mr Zen.

Well, since he is so unpredictable and god-like, I'd like to think that he can render his shield to be fierce or soft.

2. If Sweeper had about 3 times XF's inner power, XF should still not be injured. Xu Zhu had about 3 times JMZ's inner strength, all those blows that JMZ landed on him did not harm JMZ.

True there.

He could have more than 3 times though.

Besides, with no inner energy to protect him, an old man like him should be dead when hit by a full power XF Dragon Palm.

Consider my point earlier about him not being able to use much of his internal resources, due to his resources being busy.

[CC]

He could have more than 3 times though.



Consider my point earlier about him not being able to use much of his internal resources, due to his resources being busy.

So, which theory do you believe? That he had more then 3 times? Or that his inner strength was diverted to attacking XYS?

If he had more then 3 times, he could easily divert 50% to XYS and 50% to defending against XF. That is still >1.5x XF's energy each. In any case, from the bold highlight above, you do seem to concede that at least some form of inner energy protection was still in place.

One thing to note, has there been any other instance in JY's books where auto-protect/inner energy protection shut-off or otherwise failed because the fighter was using his strength in attack? I don't think there are.

Say, when XF is using a full power Dragon Palm, if at that point someone like Divine Croc hit him with a punch. Do you think it would have the same effect as Divine Croc hitting someone like Mu Wanqing?

What I am trying to say is that when say, XF throws a 100% effort attack, he is not even 99% drained since he would still have inner energy reserves to continue throwing 100% attacks for the next half hour at least (e.g. XF at Shaolin). That reserve of energy might be what protects him even when he gets hit in mid-attack.