2008-2009 NBA Season

[Ghaleon]

2009-2010 Lakers > '06 Mavericks, '06 Pistons

The Mavs were and are Golden Wheel Monk-level chokers, and the Pistons were a one-title wonder that feasted on a Lakers team that was torn by the Kobe/Shaq feud (and Kobe's distraction with the sexual assault trial), Karl Malone being old and injured, and Gary Payton being unhappy This role in the triangle offense.

Not enough to overcome the opposition. After seeing what Gasol and Bynum did to Dwight Howard in the Finals, I'm pretty confident that those two twin towers can clamp down on an old and diminished Shaq as well.

I think you're underestimating the Pistons. They were one of the most well-balanced teams in the league. They had great role-players who played their role to perfection and not just a bunch of all-stars loosely glued together.

Anyway you're right, the Lakers are still the team to beat. But i would say that the Cavs got an upgrade with Shaq. They now have a legit second scoring option for the playoffs. Remember that the Cavs weren't that bad. They were the #1 team in the regular season and they made it to the conference finals. I don't know if they could beat the Magic but they definitely got an upgrade with Shaq.

[Ken Cheng]

I think you're underestimating the Pistons. They were one of the most well-balanced teams in the league. They had great role-players who played their role to perfection and not just a bunch of all-stars loosely glued together.

And they never won another title.

They were good enough to be there, but if that Lakers team from '04 had really played up to their potential, would the Pistons have really had a chance? We're talking about four Hall-of-Famers.

The Pistons feasted off that Lakers team's not being able to put the parts together. The Pistons didn't win the '04 Finals so much as the Lakers lost it.

[Ghaleon]

And they never won another title.

They were good enough to be there, but if that Lakers team from '04 had really played up to their potential, would the Pistons have really had a chance? We're talking about four Hall-of-Famers.

The Pistons feasted off that Lakers team's not being able to put the parts together. The Pistons didn't win the '04 Finals so much as the Lakers lost it.

That's the point. The Lakers were not cohesive. They were just a bunch of egos put together. Individual performances don't win you championships, team work does. And that's what the Pistons had (Pistons also had great defense and defense wins you championships as well). They came close to winning another one but the Spurs were just a better team overall the following year (and not to mention the whole distraction of Larry Brown leaving)

[Ken Cheng]

That's the point. The Lakers were not cohesive. They were just a bunch of egos put together. Individual performances don't win you championships, team work does. And that's what the Pistons had (Pistons also had great defense and defense wins you championships as well). They came close to winning another one but the Spurs were just a better team overall the following year (and not to mention the whole distraction of Larry Brown leaving)

And the relevance to next season is this: you saw the '09 Lakers...how they won that championship, and how they celebrated. It was clear that those guys really love each other (no "homo"). They liked playing basketball together and they liked hanging out with each other. Right now, a few of them are sincerely thinking about accepting less pay so that they can continue being a team. That's your cohesion right there.

Shaq, especially as he's gotten older, has become something of a cohesion-buster. Look at what his presence did to the Suns. Although he won a championship with the Heat, he left some bad feelings behind there when he left...just as he did with the Lakers.

We're going to have to see how Shaq handles not being "The Man" in Cleveland, since that spot is LeBron's. Will he be able to coexist with LeBron any better than he did with Kobe? Shaq works best when the offense runs through him, which isn't going to happen when LeBron James is on the team.

[Ghaleon]

And the relevance to next season is this: you saw the '09 Lakers...how they won that championship, and how they celebrated. It was clear that those guys really love each other (no "homo"). They liked playing basketball together and they liked hanging out with each other. Right now, a few of them are sincerely thinking about accepting less pay so that they can continue being a team. That's your cohesion right there.

Shaq, especially as he's gotten older, has become something of a cohesion-buster. Look at what his presence did to the Suns. Although he won a championship with the Heat, he left some bad feelings behind there when he left...just as he did with the Lakers.

We're going to have to see how Shaq handles not being "The Man" in Cleveland, since that spot is LeBron's. Will he be able to coexist with LeBron any better than he did with Kobe? Shaq works best when the offense runs through him, which isn't going to happen when LeBron James is on the team.

Yeah there are lot of unknowns and with shaq on the floor the team chemistry is definitely going to change. But the huge upside is that the Cavs now have a legit second scoring option. That means they don't have to depend on Lebron or the disappearing Mo Williams to score. But we'll see what happens.

Regarding the Suns, Steve Nash wanted Shaq to be traded.

[LuNaR]

thats a bad trade for cleveland imo. now the pressure is on cleveland to win it all because if they dont, u can bet lebron is going to packing up his suitcase for new york or something. shaq is also way too old to be productive, i say hes a 10pt/8reb guy at this point his career (especially w/ the slow pace game cleveland plays).

also shaq will clog the lanes and it'l lbe harder for lebron to get to the rim


now the vince carter to the magics trade instantly make the magics scary because now they got some1 that can get to the rim other than hedo (if they get hedo back)

[Ghaleon]

thats a bad trade for cleveland imo. now the pressure is on cleveland to win it all because if they dont, u can bet lebron is going to packing up his suitcase for new york or something. shaq is also way too old to be productive, i say hes a 10pt/8reb guy at this point his career (especially w/ the slow pace game cleveland plays).

also shaq will clog the lanes and it'l lbe harder for lebron to get to the rim


now the vince carter to the magics trade instantly make the magics scary because now they got some1 that can get to the rim other than hedo (if they get hedo back)

Shaq still got 17 pts and 9 rebounds averages last season right?

[Ken Cheng]

Shaq still got 17 pts and 9 rebounds averages last season right?

Can he do it again, though? The passing of each season makes playing his game increasingly difficult. Last season was a bit of a fluke. I don't think he can sustain it much longer. Dwight Howard and Andrew Bynum are younger and faster, and at this stage, don't give up that much in terms of raw power compared to Shaq either.

[Ghaleon]

Can he do it again, though? The passing of each season makes playing his game increasingly difficult. Last season was a bit of a fluke. I don't think he can sustain it much longer. Dwight Howard and Andrew Bynum are younger and faster, and at this stage, don't give up that much in terms of raw power compared to Shaq either.

We'll see. But at the very least he'll get Mo Williams scoring numbers as the second option and get more than 8 rebounds per game. That's already an upgrade.

[Ren Ying Ying]

That's the point. The Lakers were not cohesive. They were just a bunch of egos put together. Individual performances don't win you championships, team work does. And that's what the Pistons had (Pistons also had great defense and defense wins you championships as well). They came close to winning another one but the Spurs were just a better team overall the following year (and not to mention the whole distraction of Larry Brown leaving)

That could be the problem of Shaq going to the Cavs. We might just be seeing two big egos stuck together. Shaq's clogging of the lane might hinder Lebron's drives to the basket. Remember, Lebron's penetration game isn't quite the same style as Kobe/Wade's.
Of course, it's still a no-lose situation for Cleveland, since they arn't losing anyone important in the trade. Worse comes to worse, they'll just bench Shaq and stick with the same team they had this year (which still won 66 regular season games and swept the first two rounds of playoffs). Perhaps Mo Williams will be of more production in the playoffs next year.

Still, I'm excited to see how all the lop sided trades are going to affect the season next year. Lots of Pau Gasol-like trades going around. So far, the big ones are:

Richard Jefferson-->SA
Shaq-->Cleveland
Vince Carter-->Orlando

[Ghaleon]

That could be the problem of Shaq going to the Cavs. We might just be seeing two big egos stuck together. Shaq's clogging of the lane might hinder Lebron's drives to the basket. Remember, Lebron's penetration game isn't quite the same style as Kobe/Wade's.
Of course, it's still a no-lose situation for Cleveland, since they arn't losing anyone important in the trade. Worse comes to worse, they'll just bench Shaq and stick with the same team they had this year (which still won 66 regular season games and swept the first two rounds of playoffs). Perhaps Mo Williams will be of more production in the playoffs next year.

Still, I'm excited to see how all the lop sided trades are going to affect the season next year. Lots of Pau Gasol-like trades going around. So far, the big ones are:

Richard Jefferson-->SA
Shaq-->Cleveland
Vince Carter-->Orlando

Where've you been? Busy with LHC?

Yeah true, Lebron's game is different from Kobe/Wade. He has a more balanced game. He can shoot outside shots or penetrate deeply inside. Although his perimeter game isn't anywhere near as refined as Kobe or Wade's. I still say with Shaq that's it's an upgrade. They now have a big center and second option for scoring who has the talent and size to put up 20 PPG. And if Mo Williams actually shows up in the playoffs next year, they have three scoring options.

Yeah there have been 3 big trades. The most interesting is Vinsanity to Orlando. I think Orlando is going to be a dangerous team next year.

[Ken Cheng]

Where've you been? Busy with LHC?

Yeah true, Lebron's game is different from Kobe/Wade. He has a more balanced game. He can shoot outside shots or penetrate deeply inside. Although his perimeter game isn't anywhere near as refined as Kobe or Wade's. I still say with Shaq that's it's an upgrade. They now have a big center and second option for scoring who has the talent and size to put up 20 PPG. And if Mo Williams actually shows up in the playoffs next year, they have three scoring options.

Yeah there have been 3 big trades. The most interesting is Vinsanity to Orlando. I think Orlando is going to be a dangerous team next year.

In 2007-2008, all the big moves were out West...Lakers (Gasol), Suns (Shaq), and Mavericks (Kidd).

This time, it's all Eastern Conference.

And then, there's tonight's draft...

[Ghaleon]

In 2007-2008, all the big moves were out West...Lakers (Gasol), Suns (Shaq), and Mavericks (Kidd).

This time, it's all Eastern Conference.

And then, there's tonight's draft...

Blake Griffin #1. The question is who's going to be #2? Some people predict its Thabeet because Rubio doesn't want to go to Memphis. I'm in Toronto so i'm curious who we are going to pick at #9. I hope we get Tyreke Evans but i doubt it. He'll probably go top 5.

Edit - Rubio went at #5 to Minnesota. Toronto is picking next :d

[Ken Cheng]

Blake Griffin #1. The question is who's going to be #2? Some people predict its Thabeet because Rubio doesn't want to go to Memphis. I'm in Toronto so i'm curious who we are going to pick at #9. I hope we get Tyreke Evans but i doubt it. He'll probably go top 5.

Edit - Rubio went at #5 to Minnesota. Toronto is picking next :d

Lakers have sold at least one of their picks for cash. I think the Lakers' priority is to *not* change personnel. They're looking at keeping mostly everybody that they had last year.

[Ghaleon]

Lakers have sold at least one of their picks for cash. I think the Lakers' priority is to *not* change personnel. They're looking at keeping mostly everybody that they had last year.

We picked DEMAR DEROZAN (small forward) at #9 . A pretty good pick by Colangelo. I was hoping to get Tyreke Evans, supposedly the most talented in the draft. Well Lakers are already the defending NBA champs so its not like they need to change personnel. This draft is more for struggling teams like Toronto Raptors.

[LuNaR]

Shaq still got 17 pts and 9 rebounds averages last season right?

yea but he was sitting out every other game and playing in a phoenix running up tempo system and hes another year older

[Ghaleon]

^^ Shaq will be motivated playing alongside LBJ. I predict at least 18 PPG and 8 RPG performance from Shaq. Mo williams probably 15 PPG. So now the Cavs have a triple attack. the only bad thing is that this is only a temporary arrangement as Shaq is soon out of gas.

Back to the draft...

i can't believe blazers picked Carver. He's some injured spanish dude. Nobody has picked Dejuan Blair yet, another surprise. The top 5 picks were solid: griffin, thabeet, harden, evans and rubio. i predict rookie of the year will be between griffin, harden and evans.

[Ken Cheng]

^^ Shaq will be motivated playing alongside LBJ. I predict at least 18 PPG and 8 RPG performance from Shaq. Mo williams probably 15 PPG. So now the Cavs have a triple attack. the only bad thing is that this is only a temporary arrangement as Shaq is soon out of gas.

Also, Shaq won't help the Cavs much on the defensive end. Shaq was a defensive force during his MVP seasons with the Lakers, but that part of his game is long gone. He's just not going to be able to stop the Dwight Howards and Pau Gasols of the league.

[LuNaR]

^^ Shaq will be motivated playing alongside LBJ. I predict at least 18 PPG and 8 RPG performance from Shaq. Mo williams probably 15 PPG. So now the Cavs have a triple attack. the only bad thing is that this is only a temporary arrangement as Shaq is soon out of gas.

Back to the draft...

i can't believe blazers picked Carver. He's some injured spanish dude. Nobody has picked Dejuan Blair yet, another surprise. The top 5 picks were solid: griffin, thabeet, harden, evans and rubio. i predict rookie of the year will be between griffin, harden and evans.

i like the top 5 picks too except i didnt expect rubio to slide to 5th.

We picked DEMAR DEROZAN (small forward) at #9 . A pretty good pick by Colangelo. I was hoping to get Tyreke Evans, supposedly the most talented in the draft. Well Lakers are already the defending NBA champs so its not like they need to change personnel. This draft is more for struggling teams like Toronto Raptors.

but u guys are losing bosh lol, maybe Colangelo's plan is for 2010 lebron sweepstake

Also, Shaq won't help the Cavs much on the defensive end. Shaq was a defensive force during his MVP seasons with the Lakers, but that part of his game is long gone. He's just not going to be able to stop the Dwight Howards and Pau Gasols of the league.

eh i think shaq will do fine with dwight. dwight has no midrange game, hes either going to do his signature hookshot or putback dunk. thats why yao ming always dominate dwight cause dwight cant use his hook shot on yao and hosuton is a good rebounding team.

[Ghaleon]

Also, Shaq won't help the Cavs much on the defensive end. Shaq was a defensive force during his MVP seasons with the Lakers, but that part of his game is long gone. He's just not going to be able to stop the Dwight Howards and Pau Gasols of the league.

I think you're severly underestimating Shaq on the defensive end. He won't be how he was during his MVP seasons but he ain't exactly a doormat either.

i like the top 5 picks too except i didnt expect rubio to slide to 5th.

I think a lot has to do with his spanish contract buyout and his supposedly poor shooting skills. The upside is that he has good passes and he has experience running the point for his national team.

but u guys are losing bosh lol, maybe Colangelo's plan is for 2010 lebron sweepstake

Rumors only so far. Rumors.

i also highly doubt lebron would come to play in toronto. 1) they aren't championship calibre 2) it's in Canada

eh i think shaq will do fine with dwight. dwight has no midrange game, hes either going to do his signature hookshot or putback dunk. thats why yao ming always dominate dwight cause dwight cant use his hook shot on yao and hosuton is a good rebounding team.

just Shaq's size and presence is often enough.