Heaven Sword and Dragon Saber-2008

[TiffTiff]

Hey HSDS fans, there are 3 versions that you can watch online (part by part) in youtube. I've found the vietnamese version for HSDS 1986, the member that post it was smilehullet1980

I've re-watch the 2003 ones in Chinese too (well, I can't understand a thing though )

The part where Alyssa ZM cooking the fish, too bad it was in Kmer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQCpG...eature=related

[wuyuejin]

You have yet to explain to me why my logic is at fault. So far, I am still lost within your grammatical errors....

Also, if you seriously want this to be a debate, then don't use the excuse of "not having time" to defend Alyssa... because you obviously have the time to "skim" just to find one view you can argue with, and also reply to the post by Tiff. If you cannot think of reasons as to why you think Alyssa makes a good ZM, then I'll just assume that you are a hardcore fan who is just willing to blindedly defend your star. This is nothing to be ashamed of......

So... assume that you didnt skip any math lecture and have a decent brainpower to understand logic, the math teachers in the highschool you went to mustnt have taught you what two events that arent mutually excluded are?? Hm, if its the case, then you should buy a book on logic, or just google it, as its too much of a basic logical concept for me to waste time explaining to you, hahah. Who the e*f needs to resort to 'not having time' as an excuse? I dont have time as Ive got work to do and friends to hang out with but Im still rereading the book and rewatch the 2002 series to write my analysis. Only 2 chapters and 2 eps every night as while Alyssa is the actress I like the most Im not a fckin net + wuxia drama addict who wastes all the weekend debating on the net. Watch out! Heheh.

[wuyuejin]

I found another faulty logic in your previous post:

---$$$ I read the book, but not the original Chinese version. If you want to compare Alyssa's portrayal of ZM to the actual character from the original novel, then that is your choice, but I can guarantee you that not a lot of people are going to base it on the novel but more on the previous ZMs before her... and if we go in that direction, then Alyssa is possibly the worse ZM. $$$---

What is the touchstone of ZM here?? The novel's Zhao Min or Gigi's, Kitty's, whoever's ZM?? If they dont base it on the novel, then theyre wrong. Period. Time's up. See you.

[Sugar]

Hey HSDS fans, there are 3 versions that you can watch online (part by part) in youtube. I've found the vietnamese version for HSDS 1986, the member that post it was smilehullet1980

I've re-watch the 2003 ones in Chinese too (well, I can't understand a thing though )

The part where Alyssa ZM cooking the fish, too bad it was in Kmer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQCpG...eature=related

yeah the clip... from 8:00 to the end of the segment, ZM was just MESSED UP!. HEr character is no different from those Kawaìi tawiense idol actresses

[vivy17]

So... assume that you didnt skip any math lecture and have a decent brainpower to understand logic, the math teachers in the highschool you went to mustnt have taught you what two events that arent mutually excluded are?? Hm, if its the case, then you should buy a book on logic, or just google it, as its too much of a basic logical concept for me to waste time explaining to you, hahah. Who the e*f needs to resort to 'not having time' as an excuse? I dont have time as Ive got work to do and friends to hang out with but Im still rereading the book and rewatch the 2002 series to write my analysis. Only 2 chapters and 2 eps every night as while Alyssa is the actress I like the most Im not a fckin net + wuxia drama addict who wastes all the weekend debating on the net. Watch out! Heheh.

You keep saying "two events that aren't mutually excluded" and yet you don't tell me what those two events are. This is not the "logic" that you seek... this is just plain idiocracy.

assume that you didnt skip any math lecture and have a decent brainpower to understand logic, the math teachers in the highschool you went to mustnt have taught you what two events that arent mutually excluded are

Maybe you should spend less time arguing with me on logic and more on your gramar. Perhaps you should get a dictionary and a thesaurus before you preach to me about getting a logic book or logic class. Seriously.

Again, you pretty much wasted your post on trying to get me to get a logic book, and not so much on why you think your idol Alyssa is the best ZM. This proves me point, yet AGAIN, that you have no idea what you are talking about, and are just basing your opinion on your blind love for Alyssa.

If you take the time to go on this forum daily to preach to me about logic this and logic that, then you obviously have the time to tell people why you keep defending Alyssa, but you choose not to and you use the excuse of not having enough time or by telling me to get a logic book just to stall.....

[vivy17]

I found another faulty logic in your previous post:

---$$$ I read the book, but not the original Chinese version. If you want to compare Alyssa's portrayal of ZM to the actual character from the original novel, then that is your choice, but I can guarantee you that not a lot of people are going to base it on the novel but more on the previous ZMs before her... and if we go in that direction, then Alyssa is possibly the worse ZM. $$$---

What is the touchstone of ZM here?? The novel's Zhao Min or Gigi's, Kitty's, whoever's ZM?? If they dont base it on the novel, then theyre wrong. Period. Time's up. See you.

People may not always base the actor/actress' portrayal on the novel, but they usually compare the actor/actress to previous actors/actress in order to debate/discuss their strengths and weaknesess. This does not mean that they are wrong. Time is not up for anyone but yourself since you failed miserably to explain, for the third time, why you love Alyssa so much. I guess you have your own opinion, but please don't come in here and preach about how you know the novel by heart and how Alyssa is the best ZM without any support for your claims. That is just plain ignorance.

This will be the last time I choose to acknowledge your posts. I don't think you are well adjusted enough to debate about this issue. I might as well disregard your future posts since you obviously are too bias and stubborn.

[vivy17]

yeah the clip... from 8:00 to the end of the segment, ZM was just MESSED UP!. HEr character is no different from those Kawaìi tawiense idol actresses

yeah... she tried way too hard to be cute but sadly, not cute enough to justify her role as ZM.

[flamer]

vivy, as I said a couple of times before, there is no way anyone can PROVE anything about an actress' performance in a role, in this case Zhao Min. Its all a matter of opinion. I can't pull out "evidence" that Alyssa did a good job as ZM to convince you nor can I pull out "evidence" on Gigi Lai or Lisa Wong to PROVE they were not as good. Just like critics for a movie, theres always haters and lovers but which side is right or wrong? Everyone is justified for their opinions. But the haters can't force the lovers to stop expressing their love and vice versa.

[vivy17]

vivy, as I said a couple of times before, there is no way anyone can PROVE anything about an actress' performance in a role, in this case Zhao Min. Its all a matter of opinion. I can't pull out "evidence" that Alyssa did a good job as ZM to convince you nor can I pull out "evidence" on Gigi Lai or Lisa Wong to PROVE they were not as good. Just like critics for a movie, theres always haters and lovers but which side is right or wrong? Everyone is justified for their opinions. But the haters can't force the lovers to stop expressing their love and vice versa.

Hmm... I don't see it as trying to "prove" who is better. I think it is just comparing their performances from one another. I just think it is silly to say one thing when you can't defend or provide support for why you say it. I am not forcing anyone to hate or to love anyone. I just don't like it when someone challenges me to defend my points and they can't hold up their end of the bargain. I understand that because you are also an Alyssa fan, you are defending the position of your fellow fan mates, and I also appreciate the fact that you are taking the time to discuss this in a civilized position, but like I said, sometimes pure ignorance is just hard to take seriously.

I'd like to ignore Ayssa's performance as ZM in HSDS 2003 and just remember her for her role in other series in which she really caught my attention.

[flamer]

Hmm... I don't see it as trying to "prove" who is better. I think it is just comparing their performances from one another. I just think it is silly to say one thing when you can't defend or provide support for why you say it. I am not forcing anyone to hate or to love anyone. I just don't like it when someone challenges me to defend my points and they can't hold up their end of the bargain. I understand that because you are also an Alyssa fan, you are defending the position of your fellow fan mates, and I also appreciate the fact that you are taking the time to discuss this in a civilized position, but like I said, sometimes pure ignorance is just hard to take seriously.

I'd like to ignore Ayssa's performance as ZM in HSDS 2003 and just remember her for her role in other series in which she really caught my attention.

Hi there.

But you see, you're still trying to PROVE something, eg Gigi Lai did a better job than Alyssa. But the actual "evidence" are not clear cut and highly subjective. I don't quite agree with wu or you that one can find "evidence" that one actress did a highly subjective "better" job than another one.

[Huumanshadow]

whoa, been gone a few days and the tone of the debate got so hostile. Cant we just agree that everyone have their own view of who is the best ZM? Its apples and oranges people!!! I have a personal favorite ZM but i thought that they were all good in their own way. The only prove or evidence that anyone can provide is that a ZM was very different from the one in the novel, not that one was better then another. I'm going to admit that i have my doubts about Ady but until i actually see the series i have no basis for my doubts and my opnions are just based on speculations.

[babiadorkable]

how come there's no debates over who was the best zzr? hahah

[Huumanshadow]

how come there's no debates over who was the best zzr? hahah

Cuz there is no such thing? haha i'm kidding. its just that ZZR such a hard role to play that even if someone did a decent job at it people would leave that actress alone. but i think its because she not really the main character so it doesnt massively affect the quality of the whole series if ZZR was decent or bad.

Anyone know if they are actually filming at Shaolin?

[vivy17]

Hi there.

But you see, you're still trying to PROVE something, eg Gigi Lai did a better job than Alyssa. But the actual "evidence" are not clear cut and highly subjective. I don't quite agree with wu or you that one can find "evidence" that one actress did a highly subjective "better" job than another one.

If you don't agree that one can find "evidence," then how do you suggest for people to debate over ANYTHING? And since this is a discussion forum where more than half the people compare actors/series/movies etc.. how do you suggest that we compare without actualling "proving?"

[Sugar]

how come there's no debates over who was the best zzr? hahah

Sheren for me

[flamer]

If you don't agree that one can find "evidence," then how do you suggest for people to debate over ANYTHING? And since this is a discussion forum where more than half the people compare actors/series/movies etc.. how do you suggest that we compare without actualling "proving?"

Debate over anything? As in regarding to showbiz or ANYTHING in general? I'll assume its the first one. You can debate your own views of the best actress for a role but you can hardly offer EVIDENCE for it. As your view of EVIDENCE is different to others'. You may think an actress' performance in a scene is great and use it as a proof that she did a better job, but another person may think she did a terrible job there. Its all subjective and you literally cannot PROVE one actress is better than another in a role. You can suggest that your preferred actress is better but its hardly considered a PROOF. Your call for clear cut PROOF is impossible. You will also notice that you have no provided any of that CONCRETE PROOF you called for. Hence notice that it is impossible to provide.

[sunnysnow]

how come there's no debates over who was the best zzr? hahah

GYY portrayed the most likable ZZR imo

Wei Yixiao and Zhu'er
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Credits- wdsdq.com

Li Shun (DMJ) has uploaded her blog with pics of ZSF's birthday celebration/tragedy.
http://blog.sina.com.cn/s/blog_4a2821020100b93g.html
Ji Xiaofu looks totally out of place from the other E'mei students with her royalty-like outfit. She looks more like a princess than a xia nu. I actually find Li Shun more suitable than He Jiayi to play JXF. They shouldn't have switched the actresses for DMJ and JXF.

Zhu-er's new outfit:
http://blog.sina.com.cn/s/blog_4b51a7980100bgjj.html
I prefer her other blue costume though this hairstyle doesn't look as silly/clownish as the previous one.

[yanfeng]

Dear Sunnysnow and Tifftiff, greetings again! I've been out of the country (hiking) for 2 weeks and so have missed out on all the latest news and am just catching up, but I think we are all very indebted to you two for faithfully bringing us all the latest news and pictures! Tifftiff I cant believe you even manage all this without really reading much Chinese- heroic effort!

You two mustn't mind if I sometimes omit the thanks in my excitement about the content of your posts, but just for the record- you two have my gratitude!

Meanwhile- I'm MOST excited about all the news pictures! They're awesome!

Number one source of happiness for me: The fact that ZCS and YSS are looking great _and_ ZCS and his Sect-brothers at Wudang seem to have good chemistry (as much as you can tell from pictures!)- plus the last scene for them seems beautifully tragic. Can't wait for the start of the series to air! Hopefully the good chemistry and acting will overcome the rather bland, and as pointed out previously, inaccurate Wudang costuming! That was a little disappointing since this makes them look like extras rather than individual characters that each of the Wudang brothers clearly had in the book, and which you could feel individual, as well as collective, affection for!

Resident_alien more later from me about Zhu-er and ZWJ's relationship in the book!

One picture caught my eye in particular:
http://photo.sina.com.cn/list/blogpi...6562e60100c83k

This picture, at least I imagine and hope, might be the point at which, when JHPP (Golden Flower Granny) threatens ZZR and ZM playfully turns to ZWJ and says

"You'd like to go save your ZR mei mei (she uses the enderment for ZZR) wouldn't you? But if you do, ZR wouldn't be able to hold her head up in Ermei again. Tell you what, call me 'Older Sister' once and I will go and save your precious ZR mei mei for you."

Classic ZM scene, which I think was in the '86 version, and I hope will be here too!

Overall love all the ZM pictures so far- "Encore!"

[yanfeng]

Resident_alien re: relationship between Zhu-er and ZWJ I'm putting a brief post- though everyone versed in the book should feel free to chip in and improve on my understanding!

click to show/hide spoilers

When Zhu-er first meets the adult ZWJ, he has broken his legs and is being pursued by Zhu Jiu Zhen and her family. Zhu-er saves ZWJ without knowing who he is, and ZWJ, having learnt to be cautious with others, tells her his name is Ah-Niu (Cow! ).

Zhu-er even goes to get even with Zhu Jiu Zhen over 'Ah-Niu' but she ends up getting teased about her bad looks. In her defense, ZWJ swears that he is willing to and will marry Zhu-er.

After she 'dies' on the remote island, ZWJ tells his Godfather and ZZR that he has long considered Zhu-er his 'wife' in name though they never had a ceremony. In fact Zhu-er told 'Ah Niu' before she 'died' that she could never marry him since she was in love with ZWJ whom she met when they were both children!

ZWJ wrote "Beloved Wife of ZWJ" underneather her name on her grave marker.

Hence she is the 'acknowledged' wife of ZWJ. The article that I was quoting mentions this fact, and in light of how much attention the actress for Zhu-er is getting, I'm speculating that they will focus more on this relationship than prior versions.

Hope this helps!

By the way, even though I'm a big fan of the Special Olympics, and also very fully support of PC'ness in general (I believe words have power!) still I couldn't stop laughing at your post re: Special Olympics. Its half sad, but half hilariously funny ... I'm still a little guilty about finding it funny- alas, I never knew I had it in me to be so cruel... alas!

[yanfeng]

But, but, the Alyssia's version, she got all HAPPY and got LOST IN THOUGHT, she completely forgot where she was or what she was doing, until 1 of the 2 XuangMing brothers make a noise to snap her out of her dream. I thought a true leader rarely show their weakness and should not be reminded by her follwers on her mission. I know that ZM is a girl, most girls are happy to hear when someone want to marry them, but ZM is not any ordinary girl. She's strong-minded, she's cunning and arrogrant, she has goal and duties to accomplish, she's not going to fall all weak on someone else's suggestion, well, unless from ZWJ.

She only added 1 aspect to ZM's role, she make ZM more likeable, that was it. Maybe the script was bad, b/c there were some scenes when she said really weird stuff, not like words come from ZM's mouth.

If you watch the Gigi Lai's version, her face was straight mean and ruthless, she raised her voice and firmly said "Cut off his finger!"

I'm with you on all those counts Tifftiff- truly Gigi gave us one mean and cool ZM, while Alyssa gave us a likeable (if somewhat sillier) one!

Me and a friend are in the process of finishing off reviews for each of the HSDS's that we've seen as a lead up to this 2009 HSDS- though I admit I couldn't bring myself to watch the entire 1994 version again- sat through a few episodes and had to turn it off.... urgggg... talk about all the things that can go wrong with a script!

But back to ZM again: I have a personal preference for cool and mean, so I think Gigi gave me the closest to what I think of who ZM should be... even if Jin Yong disagrees! (I'm of the opinion that when an author publishes a book every reader ends up with his/her own favorite interpretation of that author's characters that perhaps even the author would not approve of! )

But the ZM in my heart is Kitty's... objectively speaking probably because I was young and impressionable when I first saw her and thought her ZM was the most wonderful thing since sliced bread (maybe even better! ).