忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」
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How true! In fact, since this is a book, it would be fair to say that Jin Yong wrote some things with an intention. human psyche and random occurances happened alot in reallife, but when it comes to books, there is almost always a certain theme the writer is trying to convey. ^_^ its nice to always explore the alternatives, sometimes even beyond what the author implied.
Athlee, you are quite a walking encyclopedia of Chinese sayings. I like it
忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」
My criticism wasn't directed at your posts, but rather those that claim Guo Fu "sacrificed herself for her country" without acknowledging that such a claim is, at best, very contentious - and, at worst, utter dog****.Originally Posted by Linda
I agree with your implication, but I don't see how it's relevant, as I'm not claiming that GF didn't die at Xiangyang. I am simply pointing out that there is no information in Yi Tian Tu Long Ji confirming her ultimate fate. Maybe she died at Xiangyang; maybe she didn't. We can reasonably guess that the former is the case, but it's still just a guess, and therefore contentious.Originally Posted by Linda
More to the point, even if we assume that she did die at Xiangyang, that is a proposition which is qualitatively different to the claim that she "sacrificed herself for her country". The latter implies public-spirited heroism. From what we know of her personality - sadistic, utterly self-centered, snobbish, disdainful - it is speculation to expect public-spirited heroism from her. One might as well speculate about Guo Jing developing a sudden lust for Xiaolongnu. (At least that piece of speculation is fun.)
Given that you evidently read Jinyong's novels - which I respect you for - I'm surprised that you say that. As a general statement, I completely disagree. In literary works, omission is often half the story, and JY (alongside a lot of other novelists and journalists - and even lawyers, for that matter) is not averse to using this particular trick to say or accomplish something meaningful.Originally Posted by Linda
I really have to applaud Linda for sticking to the topic so well. Defending GF is an arduous task I am unable to do.
But this debate is very interesting!
Of course it was a change of topic. What you brought up has nothing to do with this thread. I don’t know what you are thinking, but I am not going around just looking to contrast your opinion with TC’s. You are not that important. I am at work and I just go to certain threads and read certain posts. If you want to point something in your favor out, then do it yourself.
As for the passages in the book, it’s so easy to find you just have to go to ROCH’s final two chapters, and see that GF was on the trip to Huanshan with GX. And go to the first two chapters of HSDS to see the GF references. With electronic versions, you just have to search for GF’s name within the text. It really literally only takes a few minutes, and even shorter if you know ROCH and HSDS well. So is that really your counter-argument for GF having changed? That I didn’t post the passages from the book?? LOL.
And of course you are wrong on this issue. You may not think you are wrong, but you are. Clearly. You have not even managed to present any evidence that she had changed at all. Just read back on your last few posts. It’s basically about me not combing over threads to contrast you and TC’s viewpoints and getting annoyed about how I am trying to prove that I am “superior,” which I am not trying to do. I am simply asking you guys to shore up your position with some evidence from the book.
What are you fighting for? Just mix them into pissing beef balls, stupid.
SOD Pt. 7 updated Jan. 6, '08
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In what way was GF sadistic? I would agree on points 2,3 and probably 4 (is disdainful a personality trait?), but I can't think of any part of the novel which would depict her as sadistic as an adult (minus the one incident with the insects/birds/beasts when she was before or about 7, these acts were never repeated to my memory). As it is, she has more than enough faults, we should be fair and not add in faults that she did not have
But since this is a Glorification Thread (impossible as it may seem), I feel obliged to say something nice about her. So after much thought and head scratching, I finally came out with one, she stayed and help out at Xiang Yang for years (intention is all that counts, not results)
Btw, that sadistic trait appears to be rather common in kids of her age. Many kids of that age tend to "experiment" around with insects and animals in various ways that many grown ups would not approve of - usually because grown ups would know better than kids do.
Kids are kids, morality and proper behaviour have yet to be set in during that time.
As such, we do not see GF repeating the same behaviour once she's grown up. If she does, then yes, "sadistic" can be officially listed as one of her bad traits and characteristics.
Still not sadism... if you are still arguing on that line. She clearly enjoys the feeling of winning, not the injury itself. That's a big difference.
Last edited by Guo Xiang; 01-12-10 at 11:40 PM.
什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟
和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩