Xiao Yu'er Vs Hua Wu Que

[CancerLuna]

It's been a while since I read the book, but having a discussion with one of the SPCnet members piqued my interest. From what I read/interpreted they were equals in intelligence and combat ability. Is this true?

[minutemanwayne]

In terms of intelligence, they were equals since they were twins but since Xiao Yu'er grew up in the Valley of Evils, he was bred to rely more on his intelligence and street smarts. Hua Wu Que should however be better in combat ability since he was trained personally by the Floral Princeses.

[CancerLuna]

I read that XYR also mastered an ultimate kind of martial arts that would put him in the same field as HWQ.

I'd have rephrase it, Intelligence vs Martial Arts ability, because while I think XYR and HWQ are equal in intelligence, XYR was trained from birth to be the wittier and faster thinking person. Same with HWQ and combat ability, despite what equal martial arts they have.

[minutemanwayne]

After practicing the martial arts from the books in the secret room, Xiao Yu'er was said to know all the essence of the martial arts in the world, but he should still fall short of HWQ. I would rank the top fighters as this

1. Yan Nantian, Princess Yaoyue
2. Princess Lianxing
3. Lu Zhong Yuan
4. Hu Wu Que. Xiao Yu'er
5. Wei Wu Ya

[Trien Chieu]

After practicing the martial arts from the books in the secret room, Xiao Yu'er was said to know all the essence of the martial arts in the world, but he should still fall short of HWQ. I would rank the top fighters as this

1. Yan Nantian, Princess Yaoyue
2. Princess Lianxing
3. Lu Zhong Yuan
4. Hu Wu Que. Xiao Yu'er
5. Wei Wu Ya

Wasn't Kong Kum (Jiang Kum/Jiang Bit Ha) becomes the most powerful man in Jianghu after he ate his son.

[Exodus]

Wasn't Kong Kum (Jiang Kum/Jiang Bit Ha) becomes the most powerful man in Jianghu after he ate his son.

is that cannon or some TVB madeup stuff???

[devilz91]

That is definitely made up.

[devilz91]

Xiao Yu'er is more intelligent overall. You can argue they are equally intelligent because they are "twins" but XYE has been exposed to many more scenarios which he's been able to show off and refine his intelligence + gain experience. HWQ has had none of that.

In terms of martial arts, HWQ has always been better, even if only slightly at the end.

[devilz91]

After practicing the martial arts from the books in the secret room, Xiao Yu'er was said to know all the essence of the martial arts in the world, but he should still fall short of HWQ. I would rank the top fighters as this

1. Yan Nantian, Princess Yaoyue
2. Princess Lianxing
3. Lu Zhong Yuan
4. Hu Wu Que. Xiao Yu'er
5. Wei Wu Ya

Pretty sure you mixed up 4. and 5.

[kidd]

I think the Floral Princess might have even discouraged independent thinking. If not, how could she control him and make him obey her in everything? I think not only is his natural wit not developed, but, might have been restricted too.

[CancerLuna]

Actually if you take the premise that HWQ and XYR are equals in intelligence because they are twins, XYR cannot be more intelligent overall. Just like if HWQ can beat XYR in a fight, does not mean HWQ has better martial arts, which is why I made the distinction between combat ability and martial arts.

[devilz91]

Actually if you take the premise that HWQ and XYR are equals in intelligence because they are twins, XYR cannot be more intelligent overall. Just like if HWQ can beat XYR in a fight, does not mean HWQ has better martial arts, which is why I made the distinction between combat ability and martial arts.

What I should have said is that "they are potentially equally intelligent because they are twins" but they are, in fact, not equally intelligent, because XYE has experienced much more.

[CancerLuna]

Xuanyuan San Guang laughed loudly, “I know Xiao Yu’er is the smartest person in the world, I didn’t expect that you’re just as good as him. It seems that the two of you should really become sworn brothers.”

Yan Nan Tian replied with a straight face, “Shifting Flower Grafting Jade is only one of the many martial arts skills of the Floral Palace. The changes in Floral Palace’s martial arts are complex, calm yet deeply profound. Besides, although I see that Hua Wu Que may not look as smart as you, but actually he’s definitely not dumber than you. Your martial arts are superficial yet messy, his martial arts is sharp yet deep.

By 2 different people, appraising them to be equals, I'd like to say author intention.

[devilz91]

lol, I remember both those quotes when I read the translation and each time I screamed bullshit. HWQ has not done anything to make me believe he's as smart as XYE. Don't really care what other characters say (esp. these two don't even know HWQ that well, and YNT is an idiot himself).

And if they are really equals, then they do not have the same potential of intelligence, because XYE has experienced so much more yet they are only equals.

[CancerLuna]

Just before the first comment was made, he showed extreme analytical skills on par with XYR.

You are totally negating HWQ's experience here (and the author might I add).

Just because one kid goes to a good school and one kid goes to a bad school, doesn't mean that, if the good school kid ends up having the same iq as the bad school kid, he somehow had less potential.

They can have the same intelligence level, with XYR knowing about more things, just the same way XYR can have the same martial arts level as HWQ, but not necessarily able to beat him.

Anyhow, potential shouldn't even be measured, it's where they're currently at that should be, otherwise we're going to have to start debating ZWJ on merits of his "potential".

[devilz91]

Just before the first comment was made, he showed extreme analytical skills on par with XYR.

You are totally negating HWQ's experience here (and the author might I add).

I am not negating anything. XYE's experience is richer than HWQ's, and that's what matters.

Just because one kid goes to a good school and one kid goes to a bad school, doesn't mean that, if the good school kid ends up having the same iq as the bad school kid, he somehow had less potential.

That is exactly what it means. Unless you think the kid who went to the bad school, if he instead went to the good school, would still end up with the same IQ?

They can have the same intelligence level, with XYR knowing about more things, just the same way XYR can have the same martial arts level as HWQ, but not necessarily able to beat him.

I agree. And that is why XYE is smarter overall. Maybe we aren't really disagreeing?

Anyhow, potential shouldn't even be measured, it's where they're currently at that should be, otherwise we're going to have to start debating ZWJ on merits of his "potential".

Alright. Currently, XYE is smarter than HWQ.

[CancerLuna]

XYR goes to college
HWQ stops after highschool

They still have the same intelligence with the same potential, despite what XYR learns from his college classes, only thing that is changed is XYR knows more

Would you say a trivia contestant is smarter than Einstein based on the fact that they know more?

[devilz91]

Yes, on the certain aspects that they know more about, they would be smarter. But Einstein would be smarter overall. I'm smarter than Einstein when it comes to Chinese, but he'd whip me in Physics.

[tape]

XYR goes to college
HWQ stops after highschool

They still have the same intelligence with the same potential, despite what XYR learns from his college classes, only thing that is changed is XYR knows more

Would you say a trivia contestant is smarter than Einstein based on the fact that they know more?

It depends on what XYR learned in college, and whether that knowledge helps him grow to be even "smarter". We'd have to define smarter to make sure we're on the same page.

If XYR took some advanced classes in useful fields and is introduced to a lot of intellectuals and advanced concepts, he would be able to grasp new ideas faster because of his more solid foundation. He would be considered smarter to most people. HWQ had the potential to do the same thing, but since he didn't he is currently not as smart.

Normal indicators of intelligence such as logic, abstract reasoning, and intuitive resourcefulness can be trained, so two people with equal potential, with one training and the other not, would lead to one person being more intelligent.

[CancerLuna]

The example was more to reply to the notion that if one's experience is supposedly richer, they should be smarter, and to be anything otherwise is a mark against potential.

My main point is that, the type of intelligence XYR shows, HWQ produced to, right before the first person commented on his intelligence. I'm of the notion that, although different, HWQ's experience was similar in "richness", despite being different, and may not even be geared towards the wit, but "logic, abstract reasoning, and intuitive resourcefulness".

Yes, on the certain aspects that they know more about, they would be smarter. But Einstein would be smarter overall. I'm smarter than Einstein when it comes to Chinese, but he'd whip me in Physics.

Well that's my main point, you're basically saying, XYR and HWQ = Equal BUT XYR has experiences to offset the intelligence and make him "overall" smarter. You're effectively negating what experiences HWQ may have had in his life. HWQ didn't need to grow up learning the same kind of "smarts" but I wager he is just as smart.

And no my example was a TRIVIA contestant, I picked this on the fact that they should "know" more than Einstein but definitely not smarter.

Another example to illustrate my point, a scientist vs a drug dealer kingpin. Both are smart in their own field of work, but who are you to say who is smarter? Isn't it you who is placing value on the drug dealer's wit and "street smarts"? They have wildly different experiences, but who are you to say which one is richer?