I remember in LOCH that Huang Yaoshi was surprised when Hong Qigong and Ouyang Feng were fighting each other on Peach Blossom Island. He had thought he'd surpassed them but found that they were likely on par with him. Did any of the 4 Greats (Dong Xie, Xi Du, Nan Di, Bei Gai) ever think to themselves in either LOCH or ROCH that they had surpassed Zhong Shen Tong Wong Chongyang?